Turning Hand Up Headup = Unethical?

[Jauron]

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I would like to know your opinion on this

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Given.


Now you want reasons when the only one you give is Doyle does it.

Plenty don't there is my reason.

[Felix_Nietzsche]

I just realize I could simply VERBALLY tell my opponent I have the A9-s of hearts and not DQ myself from the pot. Talking to my opponents to get a read on them is still allowed in this card room..... Players do it ALL THE TIME....

And I'll still get the same result......this seems like a dopey rule to me. You can get physical reads by talking to your opponents, looking at your opponents, but just don't show them your hand..... Perhaps my ownership of Caro's Book of Tells could get me perma-banned from my card room.....

[Rottersod]

Felix,

I have done this for years in my cardrooms and I always trust my initial read and it has served me well. Before I turn my cards up I ask if it is allowed (if I'm playing in a new room or haven't played there for a while), or I tell the dealer and the opponent that I am turning my hand over but it isn't dead. I don't think I've ever had someone tell me this was unethical and if they tried I would laugh in their face. Plus, it's not like I'm doing this a lot. Maybe 4 times a year?

Having said that, if the management in the room you are playing feels that strongly that it is unethical I'd advise you not to do it if you want to have a long, successful and friendly "career" there. Getting a reputation as an angle shooter (even if it isn't justified) will hurt you in the long run.

[DrVanNostrin]

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If you play in their house, play by their rules.

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From my understanding, it's not a rule there.

It is a rule at some places.

[pocket300]

I dont think that you did anything wrong here, turning your cards up when heads up to try to get a read has what is seemingly apart of the game now (but i really dont agree with it). That said...If your cardroom is against it, then dont argue with them, you are playing in their house, play by their rules. I know I have seen it done down in Atlantic City at almost every casino. I have had it done to me before as well.

[Diamond Lie]

It really depends on the card rooms rules. Foxwoods you can do this. Not sure about some of the casinos in AC.

[IgorSmiles]

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No one has offered me an explanation that makes sense.

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My guess is that too many people are doing it and it is causing problems.

[Diamond Lie]

Honestly most of the time it happens at a table I am sitting at, it causes a ruckus.

Knowitall#1: What are you doing? Your hand is dead now, you cant do that.

Moron#2: Why would you want to do that? Do you think you're in the World Series of Poker?

Clueless#3: Floor!

They probably get upset because the more people who see it, the more people who will use it and it creates more problems/situations than they would like to encounter I'd imagine.

[EWillers]

The simplest argument against it is that it (theoretically) prolongs the agony of waiting for a player to make a decision.

Also, as others have mentioned, there can be a snowball effect. I've always believed at the poker table, X begets X. If a player or two raises a lot pre-flop, others will raise more frequently pre-flop than they normally do. If a player checks in the dark, etc. etc.

Head-up, it's certainly within the confines of the rules. I don't think I've ever done it. Those who choose to should prolly try and keep it to a minimum.

[ijustliketoplay]

i really dont see a problem with this move at all and would be interested to hear some good reasons other than it occassionally causes a ruckus. someone tell me, what's the problem. Are we going to ban bluffing next? Or check raising? I mean this is poker - you are meant to probe your opponent for information and this seems a legitimate way to do that (providing its heads up of course). if anything it is giving away information unneccessarily and disadvantaging the person doing it. hence why i have only ever done this once, and that was against a friend and just for kicks.

jesus, i see a lot worse things happen at a poker table. if a player is unable to handle knowing what his opponent has then he really shouldnt be playing poker!