Two Plus Two Newer Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Newer Archives > Other Topics > Science, Math, and Philosophy
FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-14-2007, 09:03 PM
moorobot moorobot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,038
Default Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

When a Matrix is singular, how does one show that one row is a linear combination of the other rows?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-14-2007, 09:49 PM
Fly Fly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: placing balls into cells
Posts: 2,075
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

solve A*x = 0
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:12 PM
moorobot moorobot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,038
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

Thanks for the help attempt, but I'm too awful with mathematical language to understand how to do it from that answer.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:16 PM
pokervintage pokervintage is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 220
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

[ QUOTE ]
solve A*x = 0

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true for all large...errr..real...ah.. them symbol things there that begin with a 0.

pokervintage
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:25 PM
Fly Fly is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: placing balls into cells
Posts: 2,075
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

Oops, I misread row for column the first time. The first thing you wanted to do is look at the transpose of your matrix. In the transpose matrix, the ith column vector is the ith row vector of the original matrix.

Below is how to express a column vector as a linear combo of the others.

Let A be an m x n matrix with column vectors A1,...,An

Let x be a n x 1 vector with entries x1,...,xn.

If A*x = 0 ( m x 1 zero vector), then A1*x1 + A2*x2 + .... + An*xn = 0. Suppose you want to represent A1 as a linear combination of the others. Then A1 = -(A2*x2 + A3*x3 + .... + An*xn) / x1.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:32 PM
bluesbassman bluesbassman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Arlington, Va
Posts: 1,176
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question


It's not clear from your question whether you want to prove that any singular matrix has linearly dependent rows (or colummns), or rather prove a particular matrix has linearly dependent rows.

If the latter, you may use the fact that the following statements are equivalent for a square matrix:

(i) The matrix is singular.
(ii) The matrix has linearly dependent rows (and columns).
(iii) The determinant of the matrix is zero.

Thus, it will suffice to compute the determinant of the matrix, and if it's zero, that immediately implies (ii).

matrix determinant
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:37 PM
moorobot moorobot is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,038
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

I am asking for the latter in general, but I suppose my question is not how to prove it, but rather, how to express a row as a linear combo of the others.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:38 PM
jay_shark jay_shark is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,277
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

Think of A as the matrix and X as a single column vector.

ie , X={x1,x2,x3,...xn }T where T is the transpose .

And A can be written as {V1 V2 V3 ... Vn} and the Vi's are column vectors .

In other words , you wish to solve for x1*V1 + x2*V2 +...xn*Vn = ( 0,0,0)

The rhs is the 0 vector which may be written as (0,0,0) .

ie , V1=(0,0,1) V2= (1,0,1) V3= (0,1,1) and the xi's are scalars .

So we wish to solve for x1*(0,0,1) + x2*(1,0,1) + x3*(0,1,1) =(0,0,0)

Or x2=0 , x3=0 and x1+x2+x3=0 which implies x1=0 .

Since all three of the xi's are zero , this implies that the vectors V1,V2 and V3 are linearly independent .

Also it's important to know that a set of vectors is linear dependent if and only if some vi can be written as a linear combination of the others .If you can prove independence , then you can prove that a single vector cannot be written as a linear combination of the others .
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:51 PM
bluesbassman bluesbassman is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Arlington, Va
Posts: 1,176
Default Re: Quick Matrix Algrebra Question

I see, you want to explicitly compute the dependent relationship.

Let R1, ... ,Rn be the n linearly dependent rows of a singular (real) matrix. (Thus each row, Ri, is an n-dimensional vector.) By definition, there exists a set of n real numbers, (X1, ... ,Xn), not all zero, which satisfy the set of n linear equations:

X1*R1 + X2*R2 + ... + Xn*Rn = zero vector (size nx1)

The preceding is n linear equations for the n unknowns X1 through Xn. Just use basic algebra to solve these equations. (This is equavalent to the matrix equation a previous poster posted.)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.