Your Heisman Top 5

[capone0]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
any top 3 WITH hart is a joke

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Let me be clear - I have nothing against Mike Hart - he's a great player and he might be the best guy who ever lived for all I know.

But haven't I heard with regard to great players on underachieving teams for basically ever that team success is a requirement for the award except in unusual circumstances?
(Not talking about whether it should be or not - just saying it has been.) It seems to me like everyone wants to change the rules as long as it's a big, traditional program that's the underachiever instead of Marshall/Tulane/Hawaii/South Florida etc.

Didn't Michigan lose to a I-AA team at home and then get throttled by 30 at home in the next game, or did I dream that?

The Heisman winner CANNOT come from a I-A team that loses to a I-AA team. PERIOD.

[/ QUOTE ]

This loss is highly OVERRATED. Yes Michigan isn't good. But was it his fault. Also AP-State wasn't a bad I-AA team. Honestly I'm still pretty certain there have been 2 bigger upsets this year. Stanford over USC on the road and Cuse over Louisville.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, since a poster earlier said Hart single-handedly carried his team to a 14-9 victory, then yes of course that loss was his fault. Why did he decide NOT to carry his team to victory in that game, since he is obviously capable of it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Mike Hart got hurt that game. In the game he averaged 8.2 YPC and had 3 TDs. Is it his fault that D couldn't stop anyone in the O that both Ap St and Oregon ran with?

They had to put in Brandon Minor with the same o-line averaged 3.8 YPC. Michigan is very dependant on Hart without him for half the game ( 2nd Quarter about 10 minutes in to 2 minutes left in the 3rd) they lost to a good, but I-AA team.

[SoloAJ]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Uh...draft projections?

Charlie Ward and Eric Crouch say hello.

[/ QUOTE ]

So does Peyton Manning, wtf is your point? This is like when wack-jobs say something insane and then say "Yeah they thought Galileo was insane too" or something ridiculous. Yes, there have been busts, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm glad you tried making this analogy and everything, but it's pretty clear you entirely misunderstood Riverman's post. I know he said this, but it is worth backing him up, since you decided to try and kind of be a jerk about it.

Woodson will definitely get a boost in the Heisman race is UK upsets LSU, especially with Rafael Little Questionable or whatever.

[vhawk01]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
any top 3 WITH hart is a joke

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Let me be clear - I have nothing against Mike Hart - he's a great player and he might be the best guy who ever lived for all I know.

But haven't I heard with regard to great players on underachieving teams for basically ever that team success is a requirement for the award except in unusual circumstances?
(Not talking about whether it should be or not - just saying it has been.) It seems to me like everyone wants to change the rules as long as it's a big, traditional program that's the underachiever instead of Marshall/Tulane/Hawaii/South Florida etc.

Didn't Michigan lose to a I-AA team at home and then get throttled by 30 at home in the next game, or did I dream that?

The Heisman winner CANNOT come from a I-A team that loses to a I-AA team. PERIOD.

[/ QUOTE ]

This loss is highly OVERRATED. Yes Michigan isn't good. But was it his fault. Also AP-State wasn't a bad I-AA team. Honestly I'm still pretty certain there have been 2 bigger upsets this year. Stanford over USC on the road and Cuse over Louisville.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, since a poster earlier said Hart single-handedly carried his team to a 14-9 victory, then yes of course that loss was his fault. Why did he decide NOT to carry his team to victory in that game, since he is obviously capable of it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Mike Hart got hurt that game. In the game he averaged 8.2 YPC and had 3 TDs. Is it his fault that D couldn't stop anyone in the O that both Ap St and Oregon ran with?

They had to put in Brandon Minor with the same o-line averaged 3.8 YPC. Michigan is very dependant on Hart without him for half the game ( 2nd Quarter about 10 minutes in to 2 minutes left in the 3rd) they lost to a good, but I-AA team.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, it IS his fault. Because it was his fault they held Penn State to 9 points, according to the previous poster. If he single-handedly carried his team to victory in a 14-9 game when he had 153 yards and 1 TD, then I have no problem believing he single-handedly lost a game where he averaged 8.2 YPC and had 3 TDs. IOW, both of them are ridiculous.

I'm not saying Hart isn't great, he obviously is, I'm just saying its absurd to talk about team wins and say things like "he carried them to victory." If he carried them to victory in a 14-9 game, then EVERY loss this year has to be his fault, because why did he choose NOT to carry them to victory that time? Its ridiculous. He played a role in the win, he contributed to it, but it was not his "fault." I think you can say he played well in both games, and even better in the loss than in the win. But he did not win the Penn State game.

[vhawk01]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Uh...draft projections?

Charlie Ward and Eric Crouch say hello.

[/ QUOTE ]

So does Peyton Manning, wtf is your point? This is like when wack-jobs say something insane and then say "Yeah they thought Galileo was insane too" or something ridiculous. Yes, there have been busts, who cares?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm glad you tried making this analogy and everything, but it's pretty clear you entirely misunderstood Riverman's post. I know he said this, but it is worth backing him up, since you decided to try and kind of be a jerk about it.

Woodson will definitely get a boost in the Heisman race is UK upsets LSU, especially with Rafael Little Questionable or whatever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep, I misunderstood.

[LurchySoprano]

So after today does Andre Woodson slip into the drivers seat?

[orange]

[ QUOTE ]
So after today does Andre Woodson slip into the drivers seat?

[/ QUOTE ]
I would say so. Despite having less than spectacular numbers, he did lead his team over the #1 ranked team.

[Franchise 60]

1. Woodson
2. Matt Ryan
3. Mike Hart
4. Colt Brennan
5. Tebow/McFadden

Woodson has solidified himself as the front runner in my eyes with a win over #1 team in an amazing game, not to mention he has wonderful numbers for the year and has brought a SEC doormat to the top 10-12.

Ryan and Hart are close together, but a good distance above 4-6 imo.

[Dudd]

Someone, anyone, defend Colt Brennan over Graham Harrell. I don't understand it, one has good numbers playing a horrible schedule, the other has out of this world numbers playing a slightly less horrible schedule, both in extremely qb friendly offenses.

[iggymcfly]

No defense at this point of the season IMO. Brennan's played far and away the easiest schedule of any of the top QBs, and his QB rating is pretty underwhelming. Also, anyone who's actually watched Hawaii play this year would know that Brennan makes a ton of bad reads and regularly throws bad passes into double and triple coverage. Put someone like Paul Smith or Rudy Carpenter into that offense and I almost guarantee that they'd have much better numbers and probably wouldn't have had to go to OT to get to 7-0 either.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
No defense at this point of the season IMO. Brennan's played far and away the easiest schedule of any of the top QBs, and his QB rating is pretty underwhelming. Also, anyone who's actually watched Hawaii play this year would know that Brennan makes a ton of bad reads and regularly throws bad passes into double and triple coverage. Put someone like Paul Smith or Rudy Carpenter into that offense and I almost guarantee that they'd have much better numbers and probably wouldn't have had to go to OT to get to 7-0 either.

[/ QUOTE ]

Would they have had better numbers than Colt had last year?

b