Winrate in Stud vs Stud8?

[Whitewash]

Are the average winrates for winning players higher in 7 card stud high, or Stud 8? For example, what is considered a very good (but realisitic) winrate in 3/6 stud and 3/6 stud8 online?

Also, how much less is the variance in stud8 over the course of 20K or so hands? Is the variance in stud8 lower than any other mainstream limit game?

[SweetLuckyMe]

Depends totally on your competition. At full or nearly full tables my variance is much larger than it is heads up or 3 handed. I find stud8 more misunderstood, so more profitable. I find many stud hi players sitting in a stud8 game and raising my 4 bringin with hands like QJT and sticking around only drawing at half the pot - they're literally ATM machines and short handed with that type should easily yield 6+ BB/100 hands - with many of them you are virtually guaranteed of taking their buyin(s) given enough time short handed - especially the very aggressive and the calling stations.

7stud hi is a bit harder to dominate, and I'd consider a good longterm winrate 2 or 3BB/100, unless at very low limits like 1/2 or under, where it should be double.

For 3/6 stud hi I'd expect a bit above average winning player to average 1 to 1.5BB/100 long term. And I'd expect that same ability at 3/6 stud8 to be somewhere near a full BB/100 higher.

"Long term" is just that, tens of thousands of hands. I've had plenty of 10k hand stretches up 7 or 8BB/100 and the next 10k down 3 or 4BB/100, but "long term" is like 100,000 hands - enough time to ensure everone at the table will get roughly the same cards.

[bestcellar]

SweetLucky - are you really saying that over 10,000 hands you could be anywhere from up $4800 to down $2400 at 3/6? That much variance seems a bit wide...

[Whitewash]

[ QUOTE ]
SweetLucky - are you really saying that over 10,000 hands you could be anywhere from up $4800 to down $2400 at 3/6? That much variance seems a bit wide...

[/ QUOTE ]

And how about at stud8? Is that variance even possibly against average 3/6 competition in a split pot game?

[frappeboy]

[ QUOTE ]
SweetLucky - are you really saying that over 10,000 hands you could be anywhere from up $4800 to down $2400 at 3/6? That much variance seems a bit wide...

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not wide at all.. There is more luck in stud than you can possibly imagine.

[bestcellar]

[ QUOTE ]
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SweetLucky - are you really saying that over 10,000 hands you could be anywhere from up $4800 to down $2400 at 3/6? That much variance seems a bit wide...

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not wide at all.. There is more luck in stud than you can possibly imagine.

[/ QUOTE ]

so in stud/8 I should never play a limit with less than 400 or more big bets???? Sorry, but that seems a little absurd.

[frappeboy]

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so in stud/8 I should never play a limit with less than 400 or more big bets???? Sorry, but that seems a little absurd.

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I was refering to stud high, in which you should have a minimum of 300BB to play day in day out. I really don't know about stud 8/b but I have heard the swings are smaller

[7csCB]

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That's not wide at all.. There is more luck in stud than you can possibly imagine.

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luck = variance?

Re. your comment of 300BB. That's been my biggest slide but my BR was about 700BB to start. I'd have to guess that starting size made it a lot easier to digest the losses. What do you do when your BR is at 300BB and you go down 200? It must make it tough to stay on one's game.

Given that the very best here have confessed to +300BB slides, surely the average player, even a long-term winner, can expect deeper/longer slides and so a bigger bankroll is required.

[flafishy]

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That's not wide at all.. There is more luck in stud than you can possibly imagine.

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Stud variance is a ton worse than holdem, all things being equal.

I have significantly less variance in Stud/8 than in Stud High, simply because I play much tighter in Stud/8.