Razz - calling 4th?

[SGspecial]

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cause a 9 is gonna play a whole lot better when your 8 is concealed.

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That's a good point, but I still think a small effect in this hand. Unless villain is a LAG you have to give him credit for a very strong starter and he's likely to think he's got the better 9 on all streets. In this case, he'd be right.

[adanthar]

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Unless villain is a LAG you have to give him credit for a very strong starter

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what, he's open folding T5A? no he isn't.

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and he's likely to think he's got the better 9 on all streets.

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or he's likely to just bet and/or call his board, which is what 99% of people on FTP do anyway.

[tinkerman]

An easy fold surely with 5 of your outs gone.

[buzzard1881]

if you call 3rd you have to call 4th, so make the decision then.

[Praxising]

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if you call 3rd you have to call 4th, so make the decision then.

[/ QUOTE ]I think because it was only completed and not reraised I wouldn't feel like I had to - I believe Rusty is of the opinion you need at least a reraise to auto-call 4th. But maybe that's different up at this level from the micro we usually play? Basically, it was like ceegee said - I just felt like playing it and I knew if I saw it posted I'd be saying "FOLD 3RD!" I like your idea of deciding on 3rd, tho.' Takes the drama out of playing. I had already decided if I bricked paint and he got a real good card I was outta there - but then it was 9/T and I was surprised he bet and kinda thrown off my little plan.

Not made for high-level play.

[iStackBooks]

Although I probably call here around half the time depending on how I feel about it at the moment, I think the right move is probably to fold 4th. Here's the math:

Razz Simulation
600,000 trials (Randomized)
dead cards: 556a2
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
a83t 40.70% 243,476 1,472
8-8-a9 59.30% 355,052 1,472

A9 and two cards 8 or under is a 60% favorite over A83T. Technically you are getting good pot odds (about 4-1)... but I don't think they are good enough to offset:

1. the difficulty of playing your hand on later streets (he has the betting power and you'll have to fold if he hits good)

2. heavy reverse implied odds (you are making the 2nd best hand a lot of the time here and paying him off all the way to 7th)

and such things as this

I would only want to play this if I thought I had a pretty significant skill advantage over my opponent.

[iStackBooks]

Or if he is known to bluff...

[Praxising]

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Or if he is known to bluff...

[/ QUOTE ]I haven't looked at this in a few days, but if I'm remembering the hand correctly, it was one of the two guys who had been at the .50/1 tables the night before and were really not too good. At all. I believe I thought he was likley to have a 9 or worse in the hole. Or worse. And he did bluff, but they weren't very good.

[iStackBooks]

In that case, go with it...