Did I play this right ?

Dankenstein · #1 09-14-2007, 02:16 PM

Full Tilt 0.25/0.5 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, CO calls, Hero raises, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB bets, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO folds, Hero raises, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP3 bets, Hero calls, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 folds.

River: (15 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP3 bets, Hero calls, SB folds, BB folds.

Final Pot: 17 BB
My specific question is my raise on the flop. Is that viable with this many people in the pot ?

Aaron W. · #2 09-14-2007, 02:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
My specific question is my raise on the flop. Is that viable with this many people in the pot ?

[/ QUOTE ]

What would make it unviable?

Bulletproof Monk · #3 09-14-2007, 02:29 PM

flop call and raise are both completely fine. raise is probably marginally better

turn and river are perfect. if it gets c/r behind you on either street you can probly let the hand go

MrWombat · #4 09-14-2007, 03:37 PM

Anybody raising the turn?

Pot is big, we might have the best hand...

I really want SB and BB to fold.

Smurph64 · #5 09-14-2007, 04:16 PM

Although AK against multiplayers doesn't win as often as it does against fewer numbers it still wins more than not and therefore you can't want to keep the pot small by not betting it in case it gets outdrawn.

This is an extremely important concept to understand.

Remember each time you play AK or any other premium hand it is extremely favourable to win. When you win you win 100% of the pot. In reality however that pot effectively was paying you off more now because in other pots you are not going to collect anything.

AA over time should win around 80% of the time. That means that regardless of this particular outcome, for every dollar I put in the pot I am making 80 cents. For every dollar my opponents put in the pot I am making 80 cents.

So not betting it means I am throwing away money, even when I lose the pot.

AK works the same way except its a drawing hand with winning value. When you have situations where its the best hand at the time or even if its likely the best hand, it makes sense to bet it.

You had no idea that someone playing a lower pair would hit his second card so not betting the flop is throwing money away.

TomTom · #6 09-14-2007, 04:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Anybody raising the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]
Bah, I'm calling this down, never raising it. We have no fold equity, the ONLY raising hand here is KK, nothing else is worth protecting with a flush draw and a pair on the board.

MP3 has an 8 like every time here.

MrWombat · #7 09-14-2007, 05:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
MP3 has an 8 like every time here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm, why do we call then?

CrMenace · #8 09-14-2007, 05:25 PM

Grunch:

Flop raise is a must. This board gives Lots of opportunity for callers with two suited cards and connected 89.

I'd consider raising the turn as well. MP3 may be donking the non-flush turn, and with all the cold calling going on, there's plenty of opportunity for pot building. Trips should be more likely to c/r, IMO.

Rant · #9 09-14-2007, 06:23 PM

I definitely raise the flop for value and to protect your hand from straight and flush draws. I don't understand the logic in calling. You are ahead here WAY more often than you are behind. You want the draws to pay or fold.

More people in the pot is fine. In this case they are almost certainly going to call given that they only have to put in one more bet and the pot is big. You are getting them to put in $ when you are probably ahead. This is good.

I would consider raising the turn to try to get SB, BB and MP1 out or at least pay more to draw. What are we balancing here?

You are probably ahead of SB, BB, MP1. You want them to pay more to draw and to extract value. You may be behind MP3. How likely? I'd guess it is pretty likely. How likely are SB, BB, and MP1 to call your raise? Pretty likely considering the pot size and the draws possible. I would guess either 1 or 2 will call. Assuming you will get 3 callers of your raise (2 of the early guys and MP3) then you are getting 3:1 on your raise. Are you at least 1:3 to be ahead of MP3 AND not get drawn out on? Probably not.
So, I think I call the turn and river.

Aaron W. · #10 09-14-2007, 07:19 PM

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I definitely raise the flop for value and to protect your hand from straight and flush draws.

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] and [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]