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  #1  
Old 12-01-2007, 01:23 AM
Coz Coz is offline
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Default Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

The villian who stuck in the hand was very loose, calling raises with a lot of overs with gutshots, middle pair etc, haven't seen him raise too much though, but I sensed weakness from his bet. The other guy I really thought was weak. What do you guys think, I am trying to pick up the aggression in my play but find I sometimes do some really dumb [censored]. What do you guys think?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (5 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

SB (t1990)
Hero (t1660)
UTG (t1260)
MP (t2650)
Button (t1440)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls t20, MP calls t20, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t80) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t60</font>, UTG folds, MP calls t60, SB calls t60.

Turn: (t260) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP bets t60</font>, SB calls t60, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t220</font>, MP calls t160, SB folds.

River: (t760) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero?
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  #2  
Old 12-01-2007, 01:37 AM
vers vers is offline
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Default Re: Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

c/f flop, I am never betting w/ 2nd pair multiway. As played, it's spew w/ so many in and far from a good hand.
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Old 12-01-2007, 06:28 AM
fanapathy fanapathy is offline
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Default Re: Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

^ What he said. Have at least top pair to lead out there. Check-fold top pair isn't horrible either but a tad bit weak. Don't commit a lot of chips in sn unraised pot early unless you flop two pair or better is my advice. Folding the best hand, yeah whatever, they'll be doing that a lot against you later on when it counts [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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  #4  
Old 12-01-2007, 09:31 AM
kamel kamel is offline
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Default Re: Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

I think it's better to check the Flop and see what happens. Given the description of your opponents, I'd probably stuck around by c/c all streets against the aggressive one (unless an A comes).

But I don't see a lot of value in betting out the flop (sometimes a weaker hand will call you, but you probably get more value and a better risk/reward ratio by checking). Checking also gives you a better idea of what SB might have. And if you are ahead, you probably don't need to protect your hand a lot, because if you are ahead villain(s) most likely have only 2-5-7 Outs.

As played, you bet-out this dry KJ-Board and got 2 Callers and at the turn one of them bet and the other guy also calls, I'd be done with the hand. They might be weak, but it's hard, even if they are, that not one will currently beat you. And even in this scenario, they will have 12 Outs against you or so. So, you might c/c the turn based on odds as they make it so cheap., but c/r seems to be a fancy play. Also, you can't represent here really a monster. KK/JJ would you have probably raised pf and even if not, there were no 3player action if you have those blockers in your hand. By c/r here, you represent KJ or Bottom-Set or a weak hand. The last one is the most likely, so your villains won't fold top-pair or AJ or so here IMHO.

But to outline it, I think it's much better to check the flop, probably call the aggressive one, but don't call 2 players and if you just don't want to gamble, just c/f like here already suggested.
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  #5  
Old 12-01-2007, 11:02 AM
lucid75 lucid75 is offline
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Default Re: Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

C/F flop. It's marginal spot in the early levels. +/- 100 chips this early = +/- masturbation while sitting out during 10/20, 15/30, 25/50.
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  #6  
Old 12-02-2007, 03:36 AM
drzen drzen is offline
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Default Re: Middle Pair, sensing weakness, Donk move?

Just fold on the river before you get tempted to spew even more chips.
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