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#31
11-16-2007, 01:08 AM
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Re: 20/40 I\'m a Payoff Machine
[ QUOTE ]
Another question, how should you play K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]? [/ QUOTE ] KcKs makes it less likely he is trying to snow you with Jcx, right? So oddly enough, we should be more inclined to fold this stronger hand. But unfortunately we beat QxJc. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] Some players are like that. They think they're bluffing, and then accidently value-bet their 2nd/3rd pair on the river when you have an underpair. I think you're cooked in this TT hand, but against tricky types, I have a hard time giving it up even I though I feel stupid most of the time when they show me A-no kicker. 
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#32
11-16-2007, 01:23 AM
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Re: 20/40 I\'m a Payoff Machine
The SB's range seems to me to mostly consist of hands that whoop your a$$. I think this is an easy river fold.
In general, I don't give an unknown credit for check-raising the flop with the lone J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. I give him even less credit for pushing it the whole way trying to get you off a hand. The K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] is obviously a possibility, but IMO, it's a relatively small part of his range. It seems unlikely that an unknown who would flat call a button raise from the SB will all of a sudden get cute with a bare flush draw and bluff it the whole way. Sure, a few select players are tricky in that weird way, but you have no evidence that the SB here is of that mold. I think his range is far more polarized to a made flush with two random suited cards, an ace, two pair, or 555 (FWIW, I think a queen is a pretty small part of his range; again, is a player who flats a button raise from the SB c/r'ing middle pair on a monotone flop?). Your equity seems very bad on the river, and I honestly don't think it's especially good on the turn either, because you can't play perfectly on the river no matter what card hits.
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#33
11-16-2007, 08:19 AM
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Re: 20/40 I\'m a Payoff Machine
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Another question, how should you play K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]? [/ QUOTE ] KcKs makes it less likely he is trying to snow you with Jcx, right? So oddly enough, we should be more inclined to fold this stronger hand. But unfortunately we beat QxJc. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] Some players are like that. They think they're bluffing, and then accidently value-bet their 2nd/3rd pair on the river when you have an underpair. I think you're cooked in this TT hand, but against tricky types, I have a hard time giving it up even I though I feel stupid most of the time when they show me A-no kicker. [/ QUOTE ] But if we have Kc we have the nut flush draw! Why would we be more inclined to fold that? You must be talking about the river portion only, right? I think with KcKs, early in the hand you play more aggressively and semi-bluff the flop with a reraise. I like a reraise on the flop because 1) You learn more information about your opponents hand for cheap bets and 2) It's not weak, like call/call. (You could also semi-bluff raise the turn, if you think a specific opponent will toss a range of hands) As for the river, even with KK, against most opponents, if they come out betting on the river, you are toast. fold it. Any thoughts?
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