25 NL. Facing all in re-raise on river, holding low pair

[zasterguava]

This is my first post here and a hand from my first 2k cash hands I've played in the past few days (SNG transition). My playing stats are 31/14 and I have no read on opponent other than from the hand itself. Are you calling the river here and would you have put yourself in this position?

Poker Stars, $0.10/$0.25 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

UTG: $19.50
MP: $15
CO: $25
BTN: $46.90
Hero (SB): $24.65
BB: $25.55

MP posts $0.25
Pre-Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (SB)
UTG folds, MP checks, CO folds, BTN calls $0.25, <font color="red">Hero raises to $1</font>, 2 folds, BTN calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $1.65</font>, BTN calls $1.65

Turn: ($5.80) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $2.25</font>, BTN calls $2.25

River: ($10.30) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $5</font>, <font color="red">BTN raises to $42 and is All-In</font>, Hero ($14.75 to call) ???

[matrix]

fold preflop - you need a read that BTN limp folds often to make this raise profitable and at these stakes few villains limp fold OTB so we ought to expect hte limp call more often than not.

Given that button open limped he has a small pair or suited/offsuit connectors here lots and htat flop hits his range.

Flop bet is good (if a little small) Turn is OK (tho $3.50 is a better size), tho I'd probably give up here and c/f turn.

c/f the river he's very rarely calling all the way down and then pushing OTT of a river bet with a hand that loses to A6 here.

The problem here is we are OOP. Wecan't tell if we are ahead/behind easil until lots is invested in the pot - and Axs is drawing hand - playing drawing hands OOP is trouble with a capital EVERYTHING.

[Malifous]

This is really easy fold in my opinion.

[zasterguava]

[ QUOTE ]
This is really easy fold in my opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

See Matrix post to see an example of a great reply. Pretty sure it says in FAQ not to make these sorts of replies as I cant learn anything from a reply that gives no reasoning.

[zasterguava]

[ QUOTE ]
fold preflop - you need a read that BTN limp folds often to make this raise profitable and at these stakes few villains limp fold OTB so we ought to expect hte limp call more often than not.

Given that button open limped he has a small pair or suited/offsuit connectors here lots and htat flop hits his range.

Flop bet is good (if a little small) Turn is OK (tho $3.50 is a better size), tho I'd probably give up here and c/f turn.

c/f the river he's very rarely calling all the way down and then pushing OTT of a river bet with a hand that loses to A6 here.

The problem here is we are OOP. Wecan't tell if we are ahead/behind easil until lots is invested in the pot - and Axs is drawing hand - playing drawing hands OOP is trouble with a capital EVERYTHING.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Matrix. I've read some of the strat post and havn't seen much on how to play SB and BB except for 'play tight'. Is this how you play the SB/BB? I mean I robotically raise with axs if folded to me in mp-lp; with 1 or 2 limpers in SB I find it hard to lay it down and thus opt for a standard raise as I will usually have the best hand in that spot and often take it down there.

[gregorio]

[ QUOTE ]
My playing stats are 31/14 and I have no read on opponent other than from the hand itself.


[/ QUOTE ]

Just a comment on your stats. If you are just starting NL cash, you're VPIP is way too high. Probably 18-22 VPIP is a good number of hands to play. You have to be pretty damn good post flop to play with VPIP of 31. And, your PFR is way too low in comparison to your VPIP. In 6max cash games, you don't ever want to open-limp. If you are first in, raise. And you rarely want to overlimp. If your hand is worth playing, raise the limper. If it is really marginal and not worth a raise, then toss it rather than overlimping. Your PFR shouldn't be more than 4 or 5 % less than your VPIP, and even something like 22/20 or 20/18 is good. YOu will never be able to move up with stats like 31/14.

I am wondering where your high VPIP comes from. Are you complete too many hands from SB, defending your blinds too much, open limping or overlimping, or a combination. All of these are leaks, and you should work on playing fewer hands, and not playing marginal hands (like A6s) OOP.

[LGs0pHT]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My playing stats are 31/14 and I have no read on opponent other than from the hand itself.


[/ QUOTE ]

Just a comment on your stats. If you are just starting NL cash, you're VPIP is way too high. Probably 18-22 VPIP is a good number of hands to play. You have to be pretty damn good post flop to play with VPIP of 31. And, your PFR is way too low in comparison to your VPIP. In 6max cash games, you don't ever want to open-limp. If you are first in, raise. And you rarely want to overlimp. If your hand is worth playing, raise the limper. If it is really marginal and not worth a raise, then toss it rather than overlimping. Your PFR shouldn't be more than 4 or 5 % less than your VPIP, and even something like 22/20 or 20/18 is good. YOu will never be able to move up with stats like 31/14.

I am wondering where your high VPIP comes from. Are you complete too many hands from SB, defending your blinds too much, open limping or overlimping, or a combination. All of these are leaks, and you should work on playing fewer hands, and not playing marginal hands (like A6s) OOP.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can beat with VPIP 31 over a large samplesize. But to be successfull with this style you need a lot of fish, willing to give you all their money when you decide to play a big pot on the turn. Against regulars, it's a waste of variance.

However, I agree on PFR. Playing 31 VPIP means should mean to play 31/28.

Limping is a waste against the fish also because you won't isolate the fish.

All in all 20/18 is usually enough for average. At certain tables however I would agree on raising and reraising close to every single hand from late position, just to isolate fish and get them to loose stacks sooner (even if they win small pots against you).

[zasterguava]

I thought the PFR is supposed to be around half of your VPIP? Or is this just full ring? My sample is only 2500 hands from 6 days and I ran good with starting hands so that accounts to some extent my high VPIP.

[kylephilly]

this is an easy fold
-do not raise this out of the SB
-complete the blind
-if you don't hit a flush draw, trips, or 2 pair shut down because you're OOP
-if you do hit any of the above, lead out
-villain has an overpair or a set and isn't folding, if he's betting good for him catch him next time

[zasterguava]

[ QUOTE ]
this is an easy fold
-do not raise this out of the SB
-complete the blind
-if you don't hit a flush draw, trips, or 2 pair shut down because you're OOP
-if you do hit any of the above, lead out
-villain has an overpair or a set and isn't folding, if he's betting good for him catch him next time

[/ QUOTE ]

As it is turned out, I called, he turned over 93 and I shipped the pot accompanied by a fist pump!

.... However, I realise from yours and others advice that I played the hand -ev and that his range makes me beat % of the time on river to make it easy fold. I've also learnt that one of my big leaks must be in SB as I wasnt previously not aware of the logic behind not raising in that spot.