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#11
11-05-2007, 04:29 PM
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Re: 54s in BB
[ QUOTE ]
The turn is awful. I would probably play for a checkraise, but if not bet more. I wouldn't fold the river. I like check/call on the river better, as villain may bluff. [/ QUOTE ] what hands do you think villain is going to bluff on this river? and are you saying that as played, bet/call > bet/fold? bc I don't see how it is. He's never raising a worse hand on this river. 
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#13
11-05-2007, 04:39 PM
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Re: 54s in BB
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] The turn is awful. I would probably play for a checkraise, but if not bet more. I wouldn't fold the river. I like check/call on the river better, as villain may bluff. [/ QUOTE ] what hands do you think villain is going to bluff on this river? and are you saying that as played, bet/call > bet/fold? bc I don't see how it is. He's never raising a worse hand on this river. [/ QUOTE ] Please don't make me break-out the hand-histories of when donks bluff into 4-card straight boards on the river. It happens ALL THE [censored] TIME. It's like my favorite bluff catch line, check/call 4-card straight rivers LOL. Seriously though, donks bluff at [censored] like this way too [censored] often even when it's so obvious they don't have the straight. In this spot he could have straight or boat I guess, but I'm not folding, although I would've never played it this way to begin with.
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#14
11-05-2007, 05:38 PM
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Re: 54s in BB
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] The turn is awful. I would probably play for a checkraise, but if not bet more. I wouldn't fold the river. I like check/call on the river better, as villain may bluff. [/ QUOTE ] what hands do you think villain is going to bluff on this river? and are you saying that as played, bet/call > bet/fold? bc I don't see how it is. He's never raising a worse hand on this river. [/ QUOTE ] Please don't make me break-out the hand-histories of when donks bluff into 4-card straight boards on the river. It happens ALL THE [censored] TIME. It's like my favorite bluff catch line, check/call 4-card straight rivers LOL. Seriously though, donks bluff at [censored] like this way too [censored] often even when it's so obvious they don't have the straight. In this spot he could have straight or boat I guess, but I'm not folding, although I would've never played it this way to begin with. [/ QUOTE ] What hands does villain get to this river with that he decides have no chance of winning with a check and turns into a bluff? He's checking back sets and overpairs a lot more than he's bluffing with them. I think the value we get from checking and letting a busted flush draw bluff is less than the value we get from a set or overpair calling calling a small bet. We will be c/cing with the worst hand a lot more than we will with the best hand imo.
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#15
11-05-2007, 05:42 PM
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Re: 54s in BB
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CR the flop once he bets so small, bet more on the turn, prob. fold the river. [/ QUOTE ]
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#17
11-05-2007, 06:36 PM
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Re: 54s in BB
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] The turn is awful. I would probably play for a checkraise, but if not bet more. I wouldn't fold the river. I like check/call on the river better, as villain may bluff. [/ QUOTE ] what hands do you think villain is going to bluff on this river? and are you saying that as played, bet/call > bet/fold? bc I don't see how it is. He's never raising a worse hand on this river. [/ QUOTE ] Please don't make me break-out the hand-histories of when donks bluff into 4-card straight boards on the river. It happens ALL THE [censored] TIME. It's like my favorite bluff catch line, check/call 4-card straight rivers LOL. Seriously though, donks bluff at [censored] like this way too [censored] often even when it's so obvious they don't have the straight. In this spot he could have straight or boat I guess, but I'm not folding, although I would've never played it this way to begin with. [/ QUOTE ] What hands does villain get to this river with that he decides have no chance of winning with a check and turns into a bluff? He's checking back sets and overpairs a lot more than he's bluffing with them. I think the value we get from checking and letting a busted flush draw bluff is less than the value we get from a set or overpair calling calling a small bet. We will be c/cing with the worst hand a lot more than we will with the best hand imo. [/ QUOTE ]agreed, most people (esp. fishy seeming ones who bet the flop like that) are checking whatever showdown hands they have imo.
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#18
11-06-2007, 07:36 AM
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Re: 54s in BB
what should I do if he raises the turn? I think I shoulda folded (at least if he made it 700+) but not sure. maybe there's some merits in making it 350 instead of 250 bec it shows more strength and I can fold to a raise with more confident and I price out flush draws? more than 350 is not a good idea though imo.
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#19
11-06-2007, 07:48 AM
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Re: 54s in BB
[ QUOTE ]
Seriously though, donks bluff at [censored] like this way too [censored] often even when it's so obvious they don't have the straight. In this spot he could have straight or boat I guess, but I'm not folding, although I would've never played it this way to begin with. [/ QUOTE ] I couldn't agree more with this. You see some absurd stuff too often to fold here - especially with villain's obvious FPS tendencies/weak-ass bets.
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