bankroll gone in 1 hour, what now

[pzhon]

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There is nothing more important in poker than bankroll management. None.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is like saying that there is nothing more important in life than looking both ways before crossing the street. Yes, if you don't, your life could end as a result. However, there is so much more to life, and for most of us, crossing the street safely is not a big concern.

I've written over 100 posts on bankroll management. People have told me that I should write a book on it. However, basic bankroll management is not a subject deep enough to warrant a book. It's hard to imagine filling an entire book with what can be said in a few minutes: c * SD^2/WR, and what the values mean.

Bankroll management is less important that crossing the street safely. Bankroll management is only for winning players. Most poker players lose, and need a budget instead. Many people blame bankroll mismanagement and variance instead of recognizing that they are not playing well.

[1o BoY]

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Bankroll management is less important that crossing the street safely. Bankroll management is only for winning players.

[/ QUOTE ]

??????

[pzhon]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
There is nothing more important in poker than bankroll management. None.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is like saying that there is nothing more important in life than looking both ways before crossing the street.
...
Bankroll management is less important that crossing the street safely. Bankroll management is only for winning players.

[/ QUOTE ]

??????

[/ QUOTE ]
Everyone has to worry about crossing the street safely. Not every poker player has to worry about bankroll managment. Most poker players lose, and need to set a budget. They do not need to manage their bankrolls until they become winning players, which most will never do.

How was that not clear? Was it because you clipped all of the context?

[SellingtheDrama]

Losing players have plenty of reason to watch their money - there are different degrees of losing player and theoretically (its true for anyone who is a winning player) they have to try and make their money last long enough to learn how to win.

[pzhon]

[ QUOTE ]
Losing players have plenty of reason to watch their money - there are different degrees of losing player and theoretically (its true for anyone who is a winning player) they have to try and make their money last long enough to learn how to win.

[/ QUOTE ]
Most losing players are not seriously trying to win. (Most blackjack players don't bother to learn basic strategy, either.) Again, they need budgets, not bankroll management, and the bankroll management guidelines so many people repeat mindlessly are not for losing players.

Is bankroll management supposed to be more important than understanding pot odds? Playing tightly? Evaluating hands? Reading the betting action? Bankroll management is not the most important idea in poker. It's not even close.

[MusashiStyle]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Losing players have plenty of reason to watch their money - there are different degrees of losing player and theoretically (its true for anyone who is a winning player) they have to try and make their money last long enough to learn how to win.

[/ QUOTE ]
Most losing players are not seriously trying to win. (Most blackjack players don't bother to learn basic strategy, either.) Again, they need budgets, not bankroll management, and the bankroll management guidelines so many people repeat mindlessly are not for losing players.

Is bankroll management supposed to be more important than understanding pot odds? Playing tightly? Evaluating hands? Reading the betting action? Bankroll management is not the most important idea in poker. It's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really understand what your saying. Obviously, in game situations, skills such as playing tightly, hand reading and pot odds are some things that one needs to master.
However, this doesnt' mean that if you master ingame "poker skills" you will inevitably become a winning player because in life noone plays their best 100% of the time.

Say someone has 10 winning sessions playing great poker at 100nl. All of a sudden they go on tilt and decide to move up and chase a small loss to 10/20NL. now we see the importance of "BR management" as every bit as crucial as ingame "poker skills" because we all know that a tilted player has highly diminished "skills" compared to the norm and that the decision to play 10/20nl at this time is an incredibly disastrous step in the wrong direction.

a player with proper "BR management skills" would perhaps continue to tilt at NL100, lose 4 Buyins (or whatever) get bored and stop playing without lsoing all their money at high stakes.

so in fact i believe "br management" is the critical factor in poker.

[pzhon]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Most losing players are not seriously trying to win. (Most blackjack players don't bother to learn basic strategy, either.) Again, they need budgets, not bankroll management, and the bankroll management guidelines so many people repeat mindlessly are not for losing players.

Is bankroll management supposed to be more important than understanding pot odds? Playing tightly? Evaluating hands? Reading the betting action? Bankroll management is not the most important idea in poker. It's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really understand what your saying.


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I see that didn't stop you from responding. If I understand your point, and you don't understand mine, maybe you should think about what I am saying, instead of repeating something to which I have already responded.

[ QUOTE ]

Say someone has 10 winning sessions playing great poker at 100nl. All of a sudden they go on tilt and decide to move up and chase a small loss to 10/20NL...
so in fact i believe "br management" is the critical factor in poker.


[/ QUOTE ]
X had a loving family, a great, fulfilling job, the respect of the community, and enough savings to handle any contingency. Then X forgot to look both ways, and was hit and killed. Therefore, crossing the street safely is the most important skill in life. If you are not satisfied with your life, study crossing the street. Not convinced? Then the contrived example and non sequitur above shouldn't convince you of anything, either.

Most poker players lose. Losing poker players can't avoid depositing money if they want to keep playing. So, bankroll management, a plan for achieving a good win rate with a low risk of ruin, is useless for most poker players. Bankroll management is simple, and it's not any part of the difference between a good and a great player.

Is this really incomprehensible? Does a book need to be written on it?

[MusashiStyle]

ok, pzhon that 's quite correct that it does not separate good players from great players however, it does allow mediocre players to maintain their win rate and not spew against much better players at stakes that are much to high for them to handle

[Jimbo]

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ok, pzhon that 's quite correct that it does not separate good players from great players however, it does allow mediocre players to maintain their win rate and not spew against much better players at stakes that are much to high for them to handle

[/ QUOTE ]

Bankroll management has nothing at all to do with your winrate. You really should trust Pzhon on this one. A winning player needs bankroll management, a losing player needs bankroll replenishment, it is as simple as that.

Jimbo

[Albert Moulton]

I would recommend having 10-20 buyins at a given level for NL. If you lose ~10 buy-ins, then move down to the next lower level to start building up a BR again. Don't move back up until you have 20 buy-ins at the higher level.

Never ever move UP levels to try and quickly win back loses that you had at a lower level. Move DOWN to win back those loses.

As for what to do with a BR of $100, I would recommend playing no higher than .05/.10 $10 NL and trying to grind out some more of a BR before moving up. Alternatively, deposit more money so you can play comfortably at a level that you want to play.