Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt

[BeatMe1]

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How is it you've played hundreds of thousands of hands of HU on full tilt, and never played a single one against the other regulars mentioned in that thread?

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As I answered in an earlier post my general modus operandi was to sit at a table and have people come to my table. There were several players I would not play and a few fish I did chase. I would like to see the stats on not having played a single hand vs. these players.


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Are you surprised that your stats line up so closely with a few other players in the same game?

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NO - I am not surprised. I would gather that most winning players have stats that are very similar playing the same game and blind structure. It would be interesting to see Gatorade's stats or better some winning high limit HU players like The Bryce's stats and see how similar they are to mine.


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Do you have some reason for refusing to chat? If someone is accusing you of being a bot in the chat seems like you would at least say "no I'm not".

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I don't refuse to chat. In my opinion I chat too much. I find the whole chat thing quit distracting.

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Do you play long marathon sessions, waiting for someone to come along for hours at a time, near your computer all the time so you can auto post and immediately begin playing?

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Yes and I play several games at once.

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Nobody is saying you can't be a good player and be using a bot too.

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Jeesh Mr. DeathDonkey what am I to do? I am told it's impossible to play like I do and be human. Now I am told watching me play live means nothing. How about Gatorade ties me to a stone and tosses me in the lake if I drown I am not a bot.

[El_Hombre_Grande]

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With no evidence presented publically, anyone taking sides is an idiot.

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QFT. Those of you supporting the seizure of his assets without public evidence are fools. If he used a bot, draw and quarter him. But what I have seen here is laughably short of proof. Consistency? The mark of a bad player. Precise timing? See, Andy Beale. Refusal to play winners? Smart player.

How long did he actively play at a time?

[ALLEN BOND]

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How is it you've played hundreds of thousands of hands of HU on full tilt, and never played a single one against the other regulars mentioned in that thread?

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As I answered in an earlier post my general modus operandi was to sit at a table and have people come to my table. There were several players I would not play and a few fish I did chase. I would like to see the stats on not having played a single hand vs. these players.


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Are you surprised that your stats line up so closely with a few other players in the same game?

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NO - I am not surprised. I would gather that most winning players have stats that are very similar playing the same game and blind structure. It would be interesting to see Gatorade's stats or better some winning high limit HU players like The Bryce's stats and see how similar they are to mine.


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Do you have some reason for refusing to chat? If someone is accusing you of being a bot in the chat seems like you would at least say "no I'm not".

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I don't refuse to chat. In my opinion I chat too much. I find the whole chat thing quit distracting.

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Do you play long marathon sessions, waiting for someone to come along for hours at a time, near your computer all the time so you can auto post and immediately begin playing?

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Yes and I play several games at once.

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Nobody is saying you can't be a good player and be using a bot too.

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Jeesh Mr. DeathDonkey what am I to do? I am told it's impossible to play like I do and be human. Now I am told watching me play live means nothing. How about Gatorade ties me to a stone and tosses me in the lake if I drown I am not a bot.

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I have been following this post and your game on FTP for quite sometime. I played you on FTP before. You were very solid.

My opinion is that Crazy Mike (his name implies it all), is a [censored] bag who sucks at Poker. He has nothing better to do with his time then accuse innocent players of botting.

I cannot imagine how you feel.

CRAZY MIKE. [censored] YOU.

[El_Hombre_Grande]

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Mr. G,

Please do not make your detection methods, or the evidence you collected against beatme public. This is not a legal issue. There is no requirement for habeas corpus.

Is it possible this is a false positive? Of course. Lots of bots got kicked off FT after Mr. G's recent efforts, and only 1 person has proclaimed innocence. This would make sense if 1 botter was running several accounts, or if there was 1 mistake.

If beatme is a botter, her motivation for making this stink probably are not to try and get her money back. She wants to rile the 2+2 community up enough so that we begin to demand to see the evidence. For Mr. Gatorade or FTP to succumb do our demands would be a huge mistake, but it's possible either party might feel the building negative publicity would neccessitate it.

I also want to know the methods and evidence used for bot detection at FTP, but not nearly as much as I don't want beatme to. Please don't tell us.

Also note how many people have come out saying 'crazy mike accused me of being a bot.' None of them got letters from FTP saying 'we are 100% sure you are a bot'. It doesn't matter what Crazy Mike's batting average is. He doesn't ban bots. Poker sites do. If you don't trust FTP to do this, play somewhere else.

Come on guys. FTP won't ban someone for not chatting. They won't ban someone for sticking to a strategy and not tilting. Would they ban someone for taking the exact same amount of time in specific situations over significant trials? I hope so, because that's pretty damned good evidence. They also will not ban someone for never playing a hand against another player, or group of players. What if they all know each other? What if they play different stakes? These things might be good indications of where to start looking for bots, but noe of it is evidence. There is more to the story that we do not, and should not, know.

If you're not satisfied with that, don't keep much of your bankroll on-site, or switch sites. The slight -EV of a remote false+ is far outweighed by the big +EV of getting rid of a signifcant portion of the tough player population, which happen to be bots.

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I applaud you for your willingness to forfeit $70,000 without public evidence. You are far more trusting than I.
I'm sure there's a job for you over at the DOJ. Generally, most people won't do business with a party that may unilaterally seize 70,000 and not fully and publicly disclose why. I know I wouldn't.

And FWIW, habeas corpus applies to cases of imprisonment, and has no application here. and I find it amusing that the seizure of 70,000 does not strike you as a legal issue. Would it if it were you, and you were innocent?

[BeatMe1]

beatme1 had literally 0 hands played against the 8 or so bots that constantly played in his games. he did have plenty of hands against The Bryce, who is the biggest winner in his games and a human, as well as other ppl that i know are very good humans




Please provide the stats you are referring to. How do I know that the stats are not a result of selective data?

[Gregatron]

OKAY:

A lot of you people are completely ignoring the fact that Beatme1 HAS addressed the main point others were making. She sits at empty tables and waits for an opponent.

Follow with me kids: If 1) Bots on FT were programmed to sit at empty tables and waits for opponents and 2) Beatme1 does the same, then she will NOT play any bots.

It's really that simple. (Unless I'm missing something. Feel free to point out any mistake in logic I just made.)

I too have a problem with any site that will take 70k with no evidence presented. I understand T&Cs and not wanting to divulge detection methods. I also remember Teddy's mom, and how "sure" Stars was.

Again, I'm reserving taking sides on this, but a lot of you guys blaming Beatme1 should rethink how sure you are.

[BeatMe1]

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I stand by what I have said... I do not work for FullTiltPoker nor do I have any say to what they do or not. They investigated the matter and made their findings, I don’t control their findings.


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Come on. You have publically stated that Full Tilt is infested with bots. You talked about getting the media involved, you listed my nickname as a bot on your site and you alluded to the fact that you got the bots on a previous post.


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Obviously you did something wrong, because you can no longer play poker on FTP...


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LOL - The penalty is proof of the crime.

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Please answer the questions that have been set forth to you and answer why you have never played 1 hand against the other bots in over 100,000 hands that you have played.


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Prove that these stats cover every hand I played at FTP? I think that you are capable of selecting the data that supports your case and rejecting the data that does not.

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bring your case to FTP


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I did that. You saw the emails. They made it clear that they would not even have a conversation with me.

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Do I, one single solitary person that has no affiliation with FTP have that much power? You make me feel powerful, thanks.


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I would love to know how many times you harassed FTP. As for making you feel powerful, history shows clearly that demagoguery works very effectively for awhile.

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And reviewing my e-mail's from my site's account I did receive an e-mail from rednight while I was underway and not in the US, not until now I know you were the same guy and surprise, surprise I knew you used a bot then too,

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What a surprise that this would be your response.

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Continuing to tell people that my lies lost you money is kind of funny and makes my ego a little bigger but I know the truth and now its time for you to share a little more then what you have up to this point.


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I have answered the questions and you are a liar.

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Once again answer the question why you have not ever played any of the other bots ever in hundreds of thousands of hands. This point is key and requires some sort of response.


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Please remember that when you say bots I think players you can’t beat. I have told people how I play. Like most of the best HU players I sit at several tables and play the majority of players that join me. There have been many times when I was playing four games simultaneously. Do the other players you accuse play lots of games simultaneously? Is my timing the same as theirs?

Gatorade have you ever thought that the players waiting for games are the toughest opponents? In general the way I play gives me the most fish. Hell, you sat at my table.

[El_Hombre_Grande]

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OKAY:

A lot of you people are completely ignoring the fact that Beatme1 HAS addressed the main point others were making. She sits at empty tables and waits for an opponent.

Follow with me kids: If 1) Bots on FT were programmed to sit at empty tables and waits for opponents and 2) Beatme1 does the same, then she will NOT play any bots.

It's really that simple. (Unless I'm missing something. Feel free to point out any mistake in logic I just made.)

I too have a problem with any site that will take 70k with no evidence presented. I understand T&Cs and not wanting to divulge detection methods. I also remember Teddy's mom, and how "sure" Stars was.

Again, I'm reserving taking sides on this, but a lot of you guys blaming Beatme1 should rethink how sure you are.

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Exactly. I can't decide whether she uses bots or not. There have been some suspect behaviour that hasn't been fully explained. But I can tell that Mr. Gatorade's public disclosure is very deficient, and FTP hasn't said a word. I don't believe stories about "secret evidence." When someone tells you they have a foolproof way of proving X, but they won't share it with you, you can rest assured that the real reason that its not being shared is it can't stand scrutiny.

[BeatMe1]

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My opinion is that Crazy Mike (his name implies it all), is a [censored] bag who sucks at Poker. He has nothing better to do with his time then accuse innocent players of botting.


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Thanks Allen - I'm glad that someone sees what I see.

[ALLEN BOND]

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My opinion is that Crazy Mike (his name implies it all), is a [censored] bag who sucks at Poker. He has nothing better to do with his time then accuse innocent players of botting.


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Thanks Allen - I'm glad that someone sees what I see.

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It is absolutely disgusting that you had 70,000 confiscated from you because of someone's obsession.

I think it is clear that Mike has an obsession with bots. He clearly fits the description of a player who is frustrated with poker that he drills a bot excuse in his head.

HE IS CLEARLY NOT THE BRIGHTEST CRAYON in the box.