Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

[LateNiteRush]

Microbob does this mean that she is 100% guilty?

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]
Microbob does this mean that she is 100% guilty?

[/ QUOTE ]


Well, she's either guilty or she isn't.
To my mind this does not convince me 100% that she is guilty.

Mike has seen more of the evidence/data than the rest of us. I would be curious what he thinks the chances of her being guilty are although I understand if he doesn't wish to disclose his own personal opinion on it.

[Mike Haven]

I'm not quite sure how much of the consultant's e-mail I am allowed to make public. I will clarify that with him.

From a hard evidence pov, I am almost as much in the dark as you. The consultant has mentioned new and what seems to be highly relevant information that he has seen that I haven't.

With regard to the information that I saw, and the explanations for such that I received from sillysal, I still had some doubt that she was running a bot.

[MicroBob]

any reason why sillysal is not presenting those explanations in this thread?
There does seem to be the possibility that she hasn't been 100% forthcoming in all this.
By some of the reactions she's gotten around here I can hardly blame her but it seems like there might be a bit more to some of her evasiveness than just the general rudeness of the pack.

And I'm not even 100% sure she's been THAT evasive at all really. Just a hunch I guess which may be fueled by some of the accusations or interpretations made by gehrig and others.

[apefish]

A little effective comunication at key points during the process probably keeps threads like this in check.

There is a reason FT threads tend to get out of hand.
We don't have to look further than the thread about the account being locked, no explanation given, and no replies to emails while the person went out of their mind thinking they were hacked to see that.

Lack of communication is clearly a problem. Sure, Full Tilt owes the general public nothing. But they owe their customers more at times, and the appearance of serving customers well certainly has to be in their long term interest.

If sillysal was/is guilty obviously the outcome is fine.
These threads are as much about the process though (or more) than they are the outcomes at this point.

Surely one cannot argue the hours that other person had their account locked and no explanation given before finally being told "oh yeah... that was nothing, you can play again" by FT is an okay way of doing business.

There are clearly a faction of players who want to give Full Tilt more business than they currently do but who are frustrated by some things in the support/customer service area and cannot justify it at this point.
I would think Full Tilt would want that business also.


edit: bob, I agree that there was something that didn't always feel 100 percent forthcoming from sal and it probably got lost in the shuffle a bit. That said I wouldnt begrudge anyone reconsidering the publicness of any issue like this at any point regardless of guilt/innocence.

[Mike Haven]

If she is guilty, then obviously she's going to try to give me reasonable explanations for the stats being what they were, in the hope that my contact with FTP would work to her advantage.

If she is innocent, she is going to give me explanations for the stats being what they were, because for a time I was a kind of middle-man, and both sides were, (apparently, to me), respecting my comments.

Having made the OP and, (definitely, imo), forced FTP to give a much higher priority to studying her case as thoroughly as possible, whether she is guilty or innocent, I can understand that she was "happy" to withdraw somewhat from the public debate. Her goal had been achieved, whatever we, here, wanted to read for our interest and/or amusement.

Maybe now that the case is finally closed for good, we will hear more from sillysal?

[Rek]

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe now that the case is finally closed for good, we will hear more from sillysal?

[/ QUOTE ]
I really hope we don’t.

If you seek support from people (whether they are friends, family or strangers) and they help you achieve your objectives the very least you owe them is the truth and keeping them informed of proceedings. She has received enormous support from this forum. Whilst I was in the minority who seemed to understand how FTP needed to do an investigation I did state that FTP could improve the way they handle such cases. Also I believe sillysal should have the right to counter any claims against her.

I don’t want to hear from sillysal ever again and when she finally came back and gave us the update on her age that was the final straw. I said I was no longer going to post on this subject but now the investigation is complete I think there is something that should be done.

FTP has been very secretive and silent throughout. Whether they have merely confiscated $47K from a cheat I don’t know but I hope that is the case. However, their procedures should be a lot more transparent and their information given to the player of a suspended account should be more accurate and timely.

Many players here no longer feel comfortable at FTP. Not because they doubt the honesty of the games but they are worried, if they are accused, their money will be seized with no recourse and no real explanation as to the charges against them. I think a petition should be organised that we can all put our names to and submit this to FTP:
• We want to know how we can have a fair “hearing” if we are accused of wrongdoing.
• We want an immediate email when the account is suspended as to what we are being accused of.
• We want a realistic timescale as to how long an investigation is going to take.
If a moderator here could organise such a petition I for one would put my name on it.

FTP cannot go into every detail of an individual case and for obvious reasons will not do so. They are however damaging their reputation by their silence.

Advice to future posters: if you seek support from a forum be prepared to sacrifice a little of your time to keep those supporters updated. It is polite and the least you can do.

[Mike Haven]

[ QUOTE ]
If a moderator here could organise such a petition I for one would put my name on it.


[/ QUOTE ]



Posted here.

[Mike Haven]

Here is what I have been permitted to pass on. I have asked for one more item of information to be released, and this will follow, if possible:

"Here is a summary of the pertinent details surrounding this case:

• Statistical profiling of the playing style of "pokergirl z" indicated some highly suspicious behavior, suggesting that the player could be using a computer program to make decisions.

• The player was questioned about this, and made a series of responses.

• The compiled evidence and the player's explanations were reviewed by senior staff of Full Tilt Poker, and presented to me for independent assessment.

• The player's arguments were found to have little or no merit, contained many inconsistencies and contradictions, and did not adequately explain the anomalous behavior.

• The player in question admitted to being dishonest in the disclosure of the circumstances surrounding the games in question.

• The player admitted to a violation of Full Tilt Poker policy by using multiple accounts, and initially lied about the use of those accounts.

• It was determined that gross misconduct had taken place, and it was decided that the seized funds should be redistributed to the victims.

From my perspective, the posts by "sillysal" to the 2+2 forums were highly selective, told less than half the story, and were clearly intended to mislead the 2+2 community.

The case is now closed.

Thank-you for your role in explaining the details of this case to the 2+2 community."

[KurtSF]

Sounds kinda like nabbing Al Capone for tax evasion. They took her money for "botting", couldn't prove it, found out she had multiple accounts, figured that would do, and used it as grounds to keep the money.

Meh, I think everyone looks pretty bad here.