10/20 NL 6handed

[Ikke]

UTG raises to 80, I cold call with 33 on the button (I have 1800, he has me covered.) Rest folds

Flop is 4 4 4 and he bets 150. Plan for the hand?

[James.]

no read? any sort of UTG PFR range? i've seen some live players limp AK and AQ so if he's that kind of guy it might weight his range towards a bigger PP.

does villain c-bet UI overs here? online i would assume the average opponent does, but i'm not sure about live. also, what does he think about you?

folding can't be too bad. even if we call(which i don't like unless we're against a certain type of player that will fire a barrell on the flop and then shut down) or make an aggressive raise(if called) when the turn comes we often won't have a clue where we stand. the way i've been running another 4 will probably turn and his 56o will take it down. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

without a read, i'm probably giving up.

[Ikke]

Villain is aggro, and openraises quite a wide range. On this kind of board he'll c-bet a lot. (was online btw)

Haven't been too long at the table and didn't know him, so don't think he had much of a line on me.

My problem is that I'm almost sure I'm ahead of his range. But OTOH my hand could be quite transparent if I continue with this hand, and he could probably push me off it,or extract max value from me with a better hand (if I continue with the hand, it must smell like a medium pp,no?)

So, just fold although we're quite sure to be ahead of his range?

[Trix]

Fold, call and reraise can all be right here preflop, it´s close imo.

I think I just fold the flop if I dont have a read on his turnplay, it´s hard to rep a hand here without history.
You beat his range, but it isn´t static throughout the hand as much as in limit and it´s a ton more expensive to call down compared to the flop potsize.

[tagWAG]

[ QUOTE ]
Villain is aggro, and openraises quite a wide range. On this kind of board he'll c-bet a lot. (was online btw)


[/ QUOTE ]

In that case I would be tempted to put in a smallish raise, say to $380, and fold to any further action.

It turns your hand into a bluff, but it sounds like you have plenty of fold equity against his wide opening range on this board. And if he calls you just to hit 6 outs, you never know, you might even get to showdown a winner.

[James.]

it sounds like it is pretty safe to say you're ahead of his range. problem is you are either going to win a little bit or lose alot. in limit we would take villain to valuetown, but here we are basically bluffing and really exposing ourself to getting owned. given our hand, the stacks and our position we have alot of options to this point on both streets. without a read i'm not getting too excited about exploring any but the more conservative ones.

[gonores]

I think you gotta call this flop, being in position and all. The goal here is to neuter him by repping quads (you would flat call here with 45s, no?). I'd probably fold if he continues on the turn, but continue the quads repping by making a bet on the turn that will lead him to believe you might just be planning to push the river. If you call the $150 on the flop and bet $400 on the turn (leaving him looking at you with $1170 to bet into a $1110 pot on the river if decides to call), overcards certainly ain't about to get funky with you, and even hands like 55 and 66 shrivel up. I'd be inclined to check the river if he calls the turn, but I could be persuaded to push the river as a bluff for any number of feel-related reasons.

Also, it's ok to raise the turn as a bluff if he bets. I'd just like to point this out. Josh wrote something very early on in this forum: don't be afraid to bluff off your entire stack. He meant times like this.

[Trix]

I hope you are kidding, this is a really bad board to bluff your whole stack as you rep exactly one very unlikely hand.

[WordWhiz]

gonores--no way I bluff off my stack here with 33. Ever heard of Zeebo's theorem? No one folds a full house ever. Villain is *never* folding QQ-AA, and rarely folding 88-JJ. Preflop call indicates a drawing hand like small pair or connectors. Flop changes nothing--if villain was ahead before, he still is. He knows this. Yeah, maybe you'll occasionally smooth call with a big hand, but this is rare. Against very aggressive opener, raise the flop, shut down to further action. Or call flop, fold turn if he 2nd barrels, otherwise bet. Never bluff off your whole stack here.

[gonores]

Cmon... Simple game theory dictates you should be bluffing in that spot from time to time. Not saying you should bluff all the time, but what hands in your range are you raising the turn with? It seems like you're only raising quads or quads. I'd think that is problematic