Another hand I probably misplayed

[tessarji]

Commerce 20/40 Friday night, 7 or maybe 8 handed.

Dude limps first in to my right on hijack. I think he is slightly too loose preflop. I have Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] on cutoff. The button to my right grabs his chips, I'm not sure if he is calling or raising but it looks like he's in. The button thinks he's a good player but IMO really is not, he hates folding postflop, and usually calls down with overcards on ragged boards.

I limp, which probably is not good.

Button raises, SB and BB call. Both blinds are hugely loose, the SB is a genuine maniac and the BB is not as crazy in the same way that David Koresh was not as crazy as Jim Jones. Both are prone to bluffing too much always.

Flop is J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] because I am lucky like that. Checked to me, I lead, button raises, BB and limper call 2 cold, I 3-bet, all call.

Turn is 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Checked to me, I fire again, button calls, BB calls, limper folds.

River is Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] BB bets. I raise. (?)

[HOWMANY]

Fold preflop. People who think they're good like to call raises with KT and QJ because they are big cards and you can't fold big cards. We already know that he's wanting to put money into the pot and I don't think it really matters whether he wants to call or raise. Of course this is an autoraise if you don't see him with chips in hand.

If you must play I prefer raise because sometimes people were planning to call 1 bet but not 2. Calling also guarantees a 4-5 way pot, not quite the situation you are looking for. Raising might get the pot HU or at least 3 ways which is just much better.

As played river raise makes no sense, you are hoping he randomly donked a 9/J on like the worst card ever and will call your raise? I guess if he somehow had a 9/J he would call the raise but that just makes no sense for his play. You can't even beat Q8. I hope you aren't dreaming that button will fold KQ/AQ.

Honestly I wouldn't be surprised at all if you won here because people are just so bad but I do not think this play is as profitable as just calling and hoping for a tardo overcall.

*edit*
GOD THIS HAND IS A TRAINWRECK I JUST SAW YOU DONKED FLOP INTO PFR ON A FLOP WHERE WHAT YOU WANT TO DO IS NOT DONK INTO THE PFR. Please check flop and then raise when a moran calls. Also take a free card on the turn if they'll let you. Yes it turns your hand face up, but don't forget that you are playing against subhumans and they are not paying attention to this at all.

Honestly it's tough here to choose the street I hate the least. Preflop and turn are pretty close. Flop and river make me want to cry bloody tears.

[ssmallz]

easy c/r on the flop. You have a draw and the pfr is to your left. This is a texbook c/r opportunity to trap the field. Betting out may clean up some outs but getting it HU against a better hand isn't smart poker in this case. Also, what are you hoping to fold here? KQ? AQ? maybe but given your description of him I doubt hes folding those hands

[tessarji]

I don't understand objecting to the flop. We expect the button to have something here? Betting lets me win sometimes when he and I both missed, while c/r just makes him stubborn and more likely I'll get called by A high on the end.

I thought the turn and river were much more spewtastic.

[HOWMANY]

You saw a flop 5 ways. You picked up an OESD. You are playing limit holdem. Your plan should be to build a big pot with as much of other people's money as possible for if you hit, not win UI.

[johnnylovescandy]

I c/c turn and river...

[Dagger78]

Flop is ok, as your Queen might be good.

Turn bet is horrible, as I assume you realize. Check, the button will think "WTF?" and give you your free card.

River raise is what? for value? to fold a better hand?

I doubt you fold a better hand, but you'll probably fold worst ones that might overcall for one bet.

[The Dude]

First of all, raise before the flop. I don't care that button is already grabbing chips, I like your hand in this spot. But you need to have the momentum, and it'd be nice to know if button is willing to 3-bet you.

Secondly, the only person your flop bet helps is the button. It gives him a chance to fold something like 88 or 77, call with hands that have outs, and raise hands like AQ. Two of these three scenarios suck for you. Check, let him bet and let some other people call, then raise if want. You should be trying to build a pot and string people along, not narrow the field in an attempt to win unimproved.

The turn bet serves no purpose. First of all, unlike on the flop you now have an equity disadvantage, so the more money that goes in on this street the more money you lose. Secondly, it gives someone else a chance to raise, knocking out people that might have paid you off on the river. And thirdly, there's pretty much zero chance you win this pot without a showdown, so you don't have any fold equity.

As for the river, this completes the grand-slam of bad decision making. You have top pair no kicker. Nobody's going to fold top pair or better, and there's no value in raising. Your hand isn't better than your opponent's more than half time you get called. Additionally, you might get 3-bet, which I'm going to assume you're not folding to.

Now, with the kind of image you obviously have I'm sure you're going to get more action from worse hands than the rest of us, but putting in this kind of action with your hand is just lunacy.

[tessarji]

But at least I played the chip-buying and tipping streets correctly, yes?

[tessarji]

I thought that the interesting part of the hand is its maybe not a no-brainer call for the button if he has KQ, AQ, KK, given two bets cold and the action to the point.

A lot depends on if his table read is the same, and if he thinks similar to me that the BB has less than Qs up at least 90% of the time.