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  #11  
Old 11-22-2007, 03:02 AM
duh duh is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

I think he has a big draw or air here a large % of the time.
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  #12  
Old 11-22-2007, 06:29 AM
olof86 olof86 is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

do not fold.
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  #13  
Old 11-22-2007, 12:12 PM
annex21 annex21 is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

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Weird spot, but with the protected pot with the fish I think it's a fold, he is unlikely to do this with a draw or any worse made hands.

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I do think the exact opposite is the case but I could be wrong. I just don`t see him ever check a strong made hand given there are so many draws I would check behind with the calling station in.

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Yah definitely agree. Why would he ever check a big hand as the initial raiser with the SB calling station in the hand? He can't assume you are strong after flatting in position, and he knows you won't bet without a real hand because you both know the SB is calling. This looks very fishy I would probably raise AI or call and get it in on a blank turn.
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  #14  
Old 11-22-2007, 12:35 PM
mustmuck mustmuck is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

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Weird spot, but with the protected pot with the fish I think it's a fold, he is unlikely to do this with a draw or any worse made hands.

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I do think the exact opposite is the case but I could be wrong. I just don`t see him ever check a strong made hand given there are so many draws I would check behind with the calling station in.

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That's the second time I've missed that MP was the PFR.

One thing that makes this position weird is that you have a hand that isn't even in your range (eh?). I always get owned when people make this call preflop.

I can't see why he would check a big (meaning better than yours) hand on the flop with the station in. It makes no sense to me at all. Also, when the board has two broadway and a flush draw on it, a flopped monster can lose a lot of value when the flop gets checked through.

I feel like your flop betting range is a little wider than you're letting on, as even most stations fold unders on a A high board?

What I don't get is if you do have the best hand, WTF does he have? I would have thought he'd lead the draw, but if you're considering folding this hand then perhaps the freecard/CR with the draw is the best play. Certainly it's the best way to fold the station if you want to attempt to fold a station.

I'm calling. Mostly because I don't believe he wouldn't just take the bet bet bet approach against the station with a made hand and our hand is very underrepped.
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  #15  
Old 11-22-2007, 03:03 PM
jj12 jj12 is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

his line seems like complete bs. I would at least call and see a turn.
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  #16  
Old 11-22-2007, 05:58 PM
duh duh is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

The thing is, you have an ace (let alone AK) here like never. And he knows it.

If he is c/r'ing for value ever, it is with a weaker Ace.
Also, this guy is almost always c-betting a draw, especially a huge draw.

Now I think his range is worse Ace, and total air/bare gutshots.
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  #17  
Old 11-22-2007, 08:03 PM
willw9 willw9 is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

Shove > Fold >>> Call imho.
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  #18  
Old 11-22-2007, 10:18 PM
mustmuck mustmuck is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

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Shove > Fold >>> Call imho.

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You really need to say why you think this is so. In particular why you think Fold >>> Call rather than fold being at the end.
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  #19  
Old 11-23-2007, 11:02 AM
MATT111 MATT111 is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

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Shove > Fold >>> Call imho.

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You really need to say why you think this is so. In particular why you think Fold >>> Call rather than fold being at the end.

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I actually called and I don`t really see why it`s clearly worse than raising as well. I am convinced it is better than folding.
Raising makes the hand a lot easier to play of course but I think there are strong reasons that favour calling. If the turn spades and I get bet into I guess I have an easy fold. Allowing the fish to put his money in bad is another reason.
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  #20  
Old 11-23-2007, 06:49 PM
duh duh is offline
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Default Re: Tricky flop spot with AK vs 2 opponents 10/20

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Shove > Fold >>> Call imho.

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So you are putting our opponent on air, but want to raise for value?

Since he will shove into you on the turn with 95% of his range (which is mostly air),
it seems like you're setting 1/2 of a buyin on fire by pushing him out on the flop.
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