Dear uNL: You are not good enough

[tarheeljks]

that's just one philosophy. you could just as easily say it's better to test the elements of looser play where the losses won't hurt as much. some people may prefer to integrate these elements into their game now as opposed to playing abc, moving up, and then potentially having to move back down b/c it doesn't work at higher stakes.

[shyturtle27]

[ QUOTE ]
that's just one philosophy. you could just as easily say it's better to test the elements of looser play where the losses won't hurt as much. some people may prefer to integrate these elements into their game now as opposed to playing abc, moving up, and then potentially having to move back down b/c it does does work at higher stakes.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ajmargarine]

Look, kids. Listen carefully. Read this.

90% of uNL posters need to focus on ABC TAG play at this point in their development. Because they don't have it down pat yet. They don't get bet sizing. They don't get pot control. They don't understand implied odds. They don't take the most effective lines. They don't put people on a range of hands and act accordingly. They don't see the reasoning behind the play they make. They don't have a plan before they bet or check and the opponent reacts in a way that makes them uncomfortable. They can't stop raising for info. etc. etc. etc.

ABC TAG is the strong foundation needed before you can add all these other elements that people are talking about. And that people are taking issue with that and can't see the point that the OP is making tells me that the mental part of their game may be lacking themselves.

[shyturtle27]

[ QUOTE ]
ABC TAG is the strong foundation needed before you can add all these other elements that people are talking about. And that people are taking issue with that and can't see the point that the OP is making tells me that the mental part of their game may be lacking themselves.

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There you go! [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[tarheeljks]

[ QUOTE ]

ABC TAG is the strong foundation needed before you can add all these other elements that people are talking about. And that people are taking issue with that and can't see the point that the OP is making tells me that the mental part of their game may be lacking themselves.

[/ QUOTE ]

i see your point and agree, but the skills you have mentioned aren't only applicable to tag play. they can and should be applied while playing a looser style, granted it is more difficult to do. obv tag is obviously the best style for most beginners b/c you are less prone to error, but i don't think that is the same as saying never loosen up at lower stakes.

[Genz]

OMG!!! WILL PEOPLE HERE PLEASE CONTINUE TO RAISE MEDIOCRE HANDS FROM UTG AND PLAY BIG POTS WITH DOMINATED HANDS!!!! I NEED YOU TO REBUILD MY ROLL!!!

(since learning doesn't really work with trial and error in poker, you don't really need to waste a lot of money doing this at the tables, but can try to get a solid foundation in theory. As long as you don't kill the games playing ABC tag, you don't have that foundation. And uNL players react slightly differently to that style of play than higher limit players, who you want to balance your play against to get your AA payed off.)

[DaycareInferno]

[ QUOTE ]
Look, kids. Listen carefully. Read this.

90% of uNL posters need to focus on ABC TAG play at this point in their development. Because they don't have it down pat yet. They don't get bet sizing. They don't get pot control. They don't understand implied odds. They don't take the most effective lines. They don't put people on a range of hands and act accordingly. They don't see the reasoning behind the play they make. They don't have a plan before they bet or check and the opponent reacts in a way that makes them uncomfortable. They can't stop raising for info. etc. etc. etc.

ABC TAG is the strong foundation needed before you can add all these other elements that people are talking about. And that people are taking issue with that and can't see the point that the OP is making tells me that the mental part of their game may be lacking themselves.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, or maybe people just don't like being insulted for the sake of people popping in to make completely obvious points.

maybe people don't like being preached to and being lumped into one big category where everyone is in the same place, with the same objectives, and the same capabilities.

maybe not everyone's goal is their immediate bottom line, and maybe not everyone aspires to be a 4Bb/100 tagbot.

i understand the point that its important to have a firm understanding of fundamentals before a person can effectively expand their game, and i agree that this point applies to a lot of people, but at the same time, i have no sympathy for people that are disrepectful and predictably met with hostility.

i also think that it was a pretty pointless thread. anyone that doesn't already understand the point isn't going to find this as some sort of revelation. they either have the discipline and will to go through the motions, or they don't. everyone already knows this. the fact that there's a bunch of "do this", "don't do this" bs tossed in just makes it even more worthless. if someone wanted to make a philisophical thread that was actually helpful, a good idea would be one that warns people to always think for themselves and take everything with a grain of salt, because people are often full of crap, and isms don't cut it in poker.

[carnivalhobo]

good post