|
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
He has a bdsd too. He has at least 4 outs. With the chance that his hand is good this can never be a flop fold.
I would raise flop. I don't see how a worse hand can 3b given circumstances. Calling flop and leaving 3rd player in just seems to be asking to be outdrawn. Our hand needs protection from overs and bigger diamonds. Btn will often have better backdoors and we want him GONE! (on your bike...) |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
How do you figure 4 outs? A 1 card bdfd isn't nearly as good as a 2 card one especially 7 high and the bdsd is a 1 gapper. I agree with Oink's assessment that it's a 3 outer.
|
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs
Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA [/ QUOTE ] So if we raise, get it heads up, bb 3-bets and we call, bb leads turn, you think we should still call? You can't be thinking sd if it gets 3-bet on the flop can you? I know, I know, stop folding. |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA [/ QUOTE ] So if we raise, get it heads up, bb 3-bets and we call, bb leads turn, you think we should still call? You can't be thinking sd if it gets 3-bet on the flop can you? I know, I know, stop folding. [/ QUOTE ] Then I'd fold turn UI Call if I pick up a fd, gut or a set (raise a set) |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
Then I'd fold turn UI Call if I pick up a fd, gut or a set (raise a set) [/ QUOTE ] word. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA [/ QUOTE ]correct me if im wrong, but you are talking about the equity for both the turn and the river, right? so hero would pay 3 small bets to win 17(10+5+2). Thats 3:17 + 4-5 implied. my point is, u cant say hero has 12 % equity and needs to call ONE small bet with the pot offering 15. To make full use from those 13 % equity he needs to call 3 |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA [/ QUOTE ]correct me if im wrong, but you are talking about the equity for both the turn and the river, right? so hero would pay 3 small bets to win 17(10+5+2). Thats 3:17 + 4-5 implied. my point is, u cant say hero has 12 % equity and needs to call ONE small bet with the pot offering 15. To make full use from those 13 % equity he needs to call 3 [/ QUOTE ] No! If you raise and BB 3-bets then you get 15:1 odds. To call that you need a little less than 3 outs to call. The decision at that point is only about that 1 bet. Not the 3-bets you put in in total on the street given that scenario. Against QQ+ hero has about 3 outs Add AdKd and AQs and he has about 3.5 outs. I just used stove to figure out the number of outs as its difficult to count backdoor outs precisely when you want your average # of outs. |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Assuming a scenario in which button folds hero has 12.3% eq vs QQ, KK, AA. Thats about 3 outs Now add AdKd and AQs and Hero has about 14.7% eq; about 3.5 outs. In any case. Folding if it gets 3-bet is a mistake IMO. In particular considering the great implied vs KK and AA [/ QUOTE ]correct me if im wrong, but you are talking about the equity for both the turn and the river, right? so hero would pay 3 small bets to win 17(10+5+2). Thats 3:17 + 4-5 implied. my point is, u cant say hero has 12 % equity and needs to call ONE small bet with the pot offering 15. To make full use from those 13 % equity he needs to call 3 [/ QUOTE ] No! If you raise and BB 3-bets then you get 15:1 odds. To call that you need a little less than 3 outs to call. The decision at that point is only about that 1 bet. Not the 3-bets you put in in total on the street given that scenario. Against QQ+ hero has about 3 outs Add AdKd and AQs and he has about 3.5 outs. I just used stove to figure out the number of outs as its difficult to count backdoor outs precisely when you want your average # of outs. [/ QUOTE ]I agree with 3 outs on the flop. it was just pretty confusing bringing the overall equity in |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
Re: 77 line check
If you have x clean outs to the nuts where villain will have no redraw then your eq vs a random hand is
x/45 + ((45-x)/45)*(x/44) Likewise if you stove your hand vs a range then you can use this equation to figure out your "clean" # of outs or average # of outs x/45 + ((45-x)/45)*(x/44) = 12.6% is solved by aproxx 3. So instead of making a tedious counting of outs you can just use stove and solve that equation in excel |
|
|