44 Set in the SB

[Frond]

I was fairly sure she was going to lead the flop here.

Fuzz, I think at some point if she keeps reraising me I have to figure she has QQ or KK and at how many bets do I assume that? I just wonder if I should have forgone the 4th bet on the small bet street and led out on the turn with hopes of at least getting a 3 bet in, being a bigger bet street. I almost like mikeca's line the best now I think. To add, like Yak said, which line gets us the most here when we are likely ahead? Hard to say exactly. I'll post the rest of the hand a but later and let you know what I did.

[fuzz66]

against the type of player you described in the OP, i find it hard not closing the betting with this hand. i dont know, i might be wrong. what is your image here, or is she even capable of noticing. also, shes on a rush, so she might be feeling invincible,maybe swept up with here recent fortunes so shes throwing here chips around even more liberally than she normally( wich,from OP ,shes already overbetting here hands absurdly) again, i might be wrong

[Frond]

I think her perception of me was tight and only coming in with a good hand. I also don't think she was the type to get this bet crazy with just top pair like an AK or AQ hand.

[fuzz66]

yea, i think your right. her 5 bet narrows it down.i still think your about even here though. im still leading any turn without a king or queen though.

[gobbledygeek]

* grunch *

I think preflop is pretty easy call for set purposes with this many players.

On flop I too go for the check raise since my position to the preflop raiser is likely to trap lottsa players, and it sounds like villain is more opt to bet than check (even with this many opponents). But even if villain doesn't bet, hopefully someone else will bet their top pair so I can maybe get in a check/raise that way. If it didn't get heads up right away I would continue raising. But now that it's heads up right away, do we potentially get more value by simply calling and then leading the turn hoping to 3bet then? I sometimes just keep autoraising the flop in this case when I should be thinking of getting the maximum...

Boy, villain sure likes her hand; set over set is just destined to lose a lotta bets I guess...

GcluelessnoobG

[Frond]

Okay, so good or bad, I just called the 5 bet by her on the flop. She then says, "Hmmmm. okay". So she figures that her hand is good since I didn't go a 6th bet. So far so good. The turn comes off the 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] I lead out, She says "Wow you bet into that?" She just calls now. River comes the 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and I bet again and she just calls. She looks perplexed & has no idea what I have at this point since I bet into her on the turn and the river. It really threw her off I think. I show my set and she tables QKo. She says "Wow, I didn't put you on that at all in the small blind"

With her little speech there after I just call the 5 bet on the flop, I wonder if it would have been likely to get another C/R in on the turn? Not really sure. It would have sucked to have it check through though on the turn and miss a bet so I didn't attempt it. That and I was hoping to get a 3rd bet in on the turn by leading out. But oh well, UPS.

[PokrLikeItsProse]

A lot of players who don't have the nuts or near nuts will slip into check-call mode if you do something that doesn't make sense, such as leading at a card that shouldn't help you. It's a tendency that makes a bet-fold line in certain situations work.

Against this particular player, it feels like her range based on the flop is KQ/QQ/KK. She doesn't sound like the sort to jam here with JT or AK. Would she with AA? Another question that you should ask yourself is if she is the sort who jams the flop with a set or slows down in order to maximize getting another bet in a bigger street.

Since her failure to raise the turn makes it look like she has KQ, I think that a possible play that you may have missed is going for the check-raise on the river.

You asked about how far you should go before slowing down. I think that The Mathematics of Poker suggested that 4-5 bets was enough with the second nuts vs a game theoretical opponent, but the exploitative strategy against a non-optimal opponent is different and you're not on the end here.

P.S. Where was this played? I think that all the places I have played allowed unlimited raising in heads-up pots only on streets that begin heads up.

[Frond]

HG

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
With her little speech there after I just call the 5 bet on the flop, I wonder if it would have been likely to get another C/R in on the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

When someone is putting in that much action on the flop, and you just call the last bet, they'll usually bet the turn when checked to.

When you bet into her, that says you have a hand and aren't drawing, but are likely afraid that she is. Which could slow her down because that's why they'd likely bet out in your spot. You're betting into a flop 5 bettor. After 5 bets, it's highly unlikely she's drawing. What's she going to put you on at that point?

Although you made out pretty good on this one, you left some of the meat in the water.

b

[Frond]

Def agree with you there B. That is why I can't help but wonder if I should have gone for the turn C/R.