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#1
08-03-2007, 04:53 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
 [/ QUOTE ] edit opps thought this thread was new didnt mean to bump it for week ago. oh and I reraise flop. Since yo udidnt I'd bet fold the turn. 
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#2
08-07-2007, 11:07 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
It's kinda funny that I didn't come across this hand until now and then only in reference to you fighting with Ribbo. Honestly though, I think this is a good tricky line against an aggressive player. You're weak lead on the flop totally tricked me as I decided you had to have a weak draw and made a C/R whereas I could have easily folded to a pot-sized bet.
Also, if a blank comes off on the turn, I'll be firing again with almost my entire range and you could get it in way better against a draw in that spot. The fact that you have position makes it a lot easier for you to tell if I missed the turn too as I'm not going to bet any draws that I missed when you're repping a draw so strongly. Occasionally, you'll lose a little when I flop middle set or something, but in general, I think this is a very good line.
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#3
08-07-2007, 11:09 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
It's kinda funny that I didn't come across this hand until now and then only in reference to you fighting with Ribbo. Honestly though, I think this is a good tricky line against an aggressive player. You're weak lead on the flop totally tricked me as I decided you had to have a weak draw and made a C/R whereas I could have easily folded to a pot-sized bet. Also, if a blank comes off on the turn, I'll be firing again with almost my entire range and you could get it in way better against a draw in that spot. The fact that you have position makes it a lot easier for you to tell if I missed the turn too as I'm not going to bet any draws that I missed when you're repping a draw so strongly. Occasionally, you'll lose a little when I flop middle set or something, but in general, I think this is a very good line. [/ QUOTE ] Yet neither of you posted how the hand finished, very poor form. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
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#4
08-07-2007, 11:23 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
Troll checked behind on the turn. Then on the river, a jack of clubs came off completing a straight. The river went check/check and Troll won with his set of aces.
I had bottom two + gutshot on the flop but not the gutshot came on the river. KJT6 to be exact.
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#5
08-08-2007, 09:34 AM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
I think this is a really great thread. I really think troll should have bet full pot on the flop. I also think iggy should have led the flop.
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#6
08-08-2007, 10:42 AM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
I think this is a good tricky line against an aggressive player. You're weak lead on the flop totally tricked me as I decided you had to have a weak draw and made a C/R whereas I could have easily folded to a pot-sized bet. [/ QUOTE ] i think this is such an underused play - it has the advantage over pot bets of appearing like a weak bet, plus if you make this 2/3 pot bet when you miss you take down just as may pots as a PSB, but save that extra 1/3 when you get called/reraised
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#7
08-08-2007, 10:45 AM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
Troll, what are you putting him on with the check raise, and what do you think he is putting you on with your call of the check raise?
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#8
08-08-2007, 10:01 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
Troll, what are you putting him on with the check raise, and what do you think he is putting you on with your call of the check raise? [/ QUOTE ] On the flop with my c-bet, I think I allowed him to have a pretty big range to check raise with. I think he would do this with any set or two pair and also of course a bluff representing the same. By me calling it, I was hoping that we would put me on a draw. The best case scenario would then be a blank on the turn, he would be more likely to bet since the draw was missed. The turn - Of course there were a lot of draws that hit and I should probably have called any bet by him on the turn or bet myself. I recall vividly when the turn hit though the thought that maybe we had completely switched hands and he had the draw...and therefore if I bet it he was either going to fold or checkraise the turn...so I chickened out and checked behind. Playing against good opponents = so much more but so much less profitable......
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#9
08-08-2007, 10:06 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Troll, what are you putting him on with the check raise, and what do you think he is putting you on with your call of the check raise? [/ QUOTE ] On the flop with my c-bet, I think I allowed him to have a pretty big range to check raise with. I think he would do this with any set or two pair and also of course a bluff representing the same. By me calling it, I was hoping that we would put me on a draw. The best case scenario would then be a blank on the turn, he would be more likely to bet since the draw was missed. The turn - Of course there were a lot of draws that hit and I should probably have called any bet by him on the turn or bet myself. I recall vividly when the turn hit though the thought that maybe we had completely switched hands and he had the draw...and therefore if I bet it he was either going to fold or checkraise the turn...so I chickened out and checked behind. Playing against good opponents = so much more but so much less profitable...... [/ QUOTE ] As it turned out, you were almost flipping a coin to bust each other. Iggy hits a gutshot, you both felt, Iggy hits his under full house, you both felt.
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#10
08-08-2007, 02:10 PM
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Re: How do you play the flop and turn against a good opponent?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I think this is a good tricky line against an aggressive player. You're weak lead on the flop totally tricked me as I decided you had to have a weak draw and made a C/R whereas I could have easily folded to a pot-sized bet. [/ QUOTE ] i think this is such an underused play - it has the advantage over pot bets of appearing like a weak bet, plus if you make this 2/3 pot bet when you miss you take down just as may pots as a PSB, but save that extra 1/3 when you get called/reraised [/ QUOTE ] The reason it doesn't work is that so many players play overly passive. The number of players who will check without the intent to check/raise and then check/raise because they sense weakness is less than 10%. Most players only like raising when they have sets or huge draws and the rest of the time will just passively call along until they make a big hand.
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