Wow new kind of solar energy

[Blarg]

New kind of solar energy, at BBC site




This seems like a pretty interesting new solar technology. Excerpts:

[ QUOTE ]
It is Europe's first commercially operating power station using the Sun's energy this way and at the moment its operator, Solucar, proudly claims that it generates 11 Megawatts (MW) of electricity without emitting a single puff of greenhouse gas. This current figure is enough to power up to 6,000 homes.

But ultimately, the entire plant should generate as much power as is used by the 600,000 people of Seville.

It works by focusing the reflected rays on one location, turning water into steam and then blasting it into turbines to generate power.

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The vision is of the sun-blessed lands of the Mediterranean - even the Sahara desert - being carpeted with systems like this with the power cabled to the drizzlier lands of northern Europe. A dazzling idea in a dazzling location.

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As is usual with these things, it's not cheaper than standard energy sources, but there's zero pollution and costs will likely come down in time. I hope they do manage to get those costs way down.

[Borodog]

I recently read about a new photovoltaic technology that drops the cost per Watt drastically, meaning that houses could be being built with solar roofs within the next 5 years. This would revolutionize the electric power generation and distribution industries, and could completely decentralize them. I expect power companies to lobby to slap massive taxes and regulations on the technology, as it could nearly wipe out the multi-billion dollar (and government created and maintained) electric energy cartel in the US.

[esad]

[ QUOTE ]
It works by focusing the reflected rays on one location, turning water into steam and then blasting it into turbines to generate power.

[/ QUOTE ]

A system like this has been around for almost 30 years. I know someone that developed such a system and tried to get it used in the late 70s to no avail.

Also, solar although having some benefits does have a drawback of not always being the most cost-efficient way to tap energy. The return on investment and maintenance is very problematic.

[Blarg]

Very interesting. I take it you mean that the solar roof on a house could supply a house's entire energy needs, or at any rate the great majority of it?

There are already somewhat odd arrangements regarding homeowner-generated electricity with some plants. In some, the homeowner can sell back some of his energy to the power company for credits, but they can only be used at particular times, etc. So it winds up that the homeowner can generate and transfer much more than he needs, but never really make a dime off it except insofar as the energy he saves. Whatever direct profit is to be made is kept as a freebie by the power company. If a whole lot of homes can start generating a great deal of energy, even surpluses, I can see some interesting lobbying fall-out as homeowners try to rationalize the process of purchasing and selling power from power companies, and power companies try to find some way to keep it so that either all the profit or as much as possible is strictly going to them.

[daveT]

If I recall this right, California has some kind of law enforcing measures for cleaner energy solutions. I don't remember the details, but I know that it involves the majors. I am guessing when these solar roofs become popular, Edison will have a monopoly on it as well.

How do they blast the water into the generator? Is this a valve system built of from water pressure? I have some vision of them having to plug this device into a wall socket somewhere.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It works by focusing the reflected rays on one location, turning water into steam and then blasting it into turbines to generate power.

[/ QUOTE ]

A system like this has been around for almost 30 years. I know someone that developed such a system and tried to get it used in the late 70s to no avail.

Also, solar although having some benefits does have a drawback of not always being the most cost-efficient way to tap energy. The return on investment and maintenance is very problematic.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, it sounds like a far from fully realized product. But it's encouraging that they've gotten to the stage at which it's worth building something this big and experimenting further.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
If I recall this right, California has some kind of law enforcing measures for cleaner energy solutions. I don't remember the details, but I know that it involves the majors. I am guessing when these solar roofs become popular, Edison will have a monopoly on it as well.

How do they blast the water into the generator? Is this a valve system built of from water pressure? I have some vision of them having to plug this device into a wall socket somewhere.

[/ QUOTE ]

This varies city by city. Some California cities mandate, for new construction, certain types of materials, usage of certain types of lightbulbs, toilets, heating and AC, etc. Sometimes places that are already built are not similarly burdened, or only made to install conforming products during a renovation.

There are also rebates and tax credits for voluntary use of certain products, like refrigerators, washers/dryers, light bulbs, etc. Some things, like energy-efficient lightbulbs, are even given out for free.

[Borodog]

[ QUOTE ]
Very interesting. I take it you mean that the solar roof on a house could supply a house's entire energy needs, or at any rate the great majority of it?

There are already somewhat odd arrangements regarding homeowner-generated electricity with some plants. In some, the homeowner can sell back some of his energy to the power company for credits, but they can only be used at particular times, etc. So it winds up that the homeowner can generate and transfer much more than he needs, but never really make a dime off it except insofar as the energy he saves. Whatever direct profit is to be made is kept as a freebie by the power company. If a whole lot of homes can start generating a great deal of energy, even surpluses, I can see some interesting lobbying fall-out as homeowners try to rationalize the process of purchasing and selling power from power companies, and power companies try to find some way to keep it so that either all the profit or as much as possible is strictly going to them.

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"Homeowners" cannot make a coherent lobbying group (distributed costs, concentrated benefits yo). The players making the photovoltaics might, but they won't be able to compete in the political bribery game with the power companies, which are some of the largest companies in the world.

[Blarg]

Yet citizens do wind up with benefits in society at times, by having politicians deign to take up their causes, or, more likely perhaps, fear not to. Look at the AARP.

I love the idea of non-centralized energy production changing the way energy is handled for the better in much the same way the internet has changed the lock that a relatively small number of media companies had on information flow. Of course the process would work much differently, but it seems mass personal energy independence could eventually be of world-historical import.

I could see some countries hopping on board with some of these ideas far before others, for the political factors you cite.

[daveT]

On solar housing. Cost analysis and everything. I imagine with the "green movement," a few celebrities have solar housing.