4/180 - value bet straight on the river?

[miw210]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (9 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

MP2 (t1870)
MP3 (t1650)
CO (t1390)
Hero (t3080)
SB (t1070)
BB (t1370)
UTG (t1920)
UTG+1 (t1340)
MP1 (t1160)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t20, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls t20, MP2 calls t20, MP3 calls t20, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls t20, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t140) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets t60</font>, UTG folds, MP1 calls t60, MP2 calls t60, MP3 folds, Hero calls t60, SB folds.

Turn: (t380) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets t120</font>, MP1 folds, MP2 calls t120, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t500</font>, BB calls t380, MP2 calls t380.

River: (t1880) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: t1880

No info on villains. Do you bet this river for value or check behind (BB has about 800 left behind, SB about 500)

[Cheetor19]

In my opinion, check behind is good enough, one of them, especcially, MP2 are very likely to have a flush.

[Nairb]

[ QUOTE ]
In my opinion, check behind is good enough, one of them, especcially, MP2 are very likely to have a flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. I do not think you get enough value out of a bet on the river to make up for the times you are behind here.

[BigZag]

I think the river check is correct, my guess is you don't have the best hand here. I believe you should've raised more on the turn when you made you're straight. With a pot at 620 when it gets to you your 380 raise is giving 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]10 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or similar, a wonderful opertunity to win a big fat pot. Raise to 740 total on the turn.

[Jesuitical]

This is a more interesting spot when you're not early in a 4/180, I think. Flushes are almost always shoving, thinking that you or the other player are pot-committed at this point and not at all worried about the possibility of a full house. They hit their draw, after all -- what they were in the hand for! -- and that's all that matters. I'd be surprised if a set played this way, but if it did it would shove the river too.

Not to say that you're always good here, but you get called worse here by random Kings and other assorted garbage (again, early in a 4/180) to shove here.

[miw210]

In retrospect, my thoughts:

1. Turn call by BB probably means either a weak king, midpair, or a club draw. TPTK, two pair, or set easily shoves I think.
2. Flop and Turn calls by MP2 probably means either a club, maybe even a straight draw with so much already in the pot.
3. River checks by both players probably means neither of them has a made hand. BB probably has a weak king or midpair, MP2 a whiffed straight draw.
4. If BB does has a weak king, there's no way BB can fold to a push by the river.

Is this a good line of thinking? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[Jesuitical]

Apparently someone caught their flush and checked it, but I still think you get value from hands you beat more often than not in a 4/180. I'm surprised he had the discipline to do that to be honest... but then again solid players are sprinkled in there with the fish.

Against better competition, you would have to be more worried about 3-4, 9-10, 10-J or 6-x of clubs, and it would be read-dependent on whether to bet or not.