Razz: FTP 24+2 HORSE Final Table, bad 5th street, help.

[Metnut]

I know i spewed some chips here, but im not exactly sure where I'm supposed to let this hand go. I've looked at the hand and I think 6th street is where i should fold, but the pot odds are ridiculous. I'm a little lost on this game, if i should've folded on 5th let me know. I just need some good razz players to tell me how they would've played this so i can improve. I apologize for the format but i tried three different hand converters and none of them work.

Full Tilt Poker Game #2883559276: $4,000 Guarantee (21486574), Table 18 - 5000/10000 Ante 1000 - Limit Razz - 2:14:45 ET - 2007/07/08
Seat 3: azbigjim (60,408)
Seat 4: 180467 (28,895)
Seat 5: emptyman (6,130)
Seat 6: WickTaylor (41,224)
Seat 7: hafholdem222 (96,447)
Seat 8: Metnut (56,396)
azbigjim antes 1,000
180467 antes 1,000
emptyman antes 1,000
WickTaylor antes 1,000
hafholdem222 antes 1,000
Metnut antes 1,000
*** 3RD STREET ***
Dealt to azbigjim [7s]
Dealt to 180467 [8s]
Dealt to emptyman [As]
Dealt to WickTaylor [Qd]
Dealt to hafholdem222 [Kh]
Dealt to Metnut [5s Ac] [3h]
hafholdem222 is high with [Kh]
hafholdem222 brings in for 1,500
Metnut completes it to 5,000
azbigjim calls 5,000
180467 folds
emptyman folds
WickTaylor folds
hafholdem222 folds
*** 4TH STREET ***
Dealt to azbigjim [7s] [Js]
Dealt to Metnut [5s Ac 3h] [Jd]
Metnut bets 5,000
azbigjim calls 5,000
*** 5TH STREET ***
Dealt to azbigjim [7s Js] [6s]
Dealt to Metnut [5s Ac 3h Jd] [9d]
azbigjim bets 10,000
Metnut calls 10,000 Can't fold here right? Do I just go away here and not call the big bet?
*** 6TH STREET ***
Dealt to azbigjim [7s Js 6s] [4h]
Dealt to Metnut [5s Ac 3h Jd 9d] [8c] I think i should've mucked here, but if hes paired up anywhere, or even if he has an 8 i think i have odds. Is this an easy muck?
azbigjim bets 10,000
Metnut calls 10,000
*** 7TH STREET ***
Dealt to Metnut [5s Ac 3h Jd 9d 8c] [Td]
azbigjim bets 10,000
Metnut calls 10,000

[Alchemist]

Tournament - Razz (5,000/10,000), Ante 1,000, Bring-In 1,500 (converter)

Seat 3: 60,408
Seat 4: 28,895
Seat 5: 6,130
Seat 6: 41,224
Seat 7: 96,447
Hero: 56,396

3rd Street - (1.20 SB)

Seat 3: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 4: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 6: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 7: xx xx K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Hero: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___completes

4th Street - (3.50 SB)

Seat 3: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Hero: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets

5th Street - (2.75 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls

6th Street - (3.75 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls

River - (5.75 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] xx___bets
Hero: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls

Total pot: (7.75 BB - 77,500)

[chucky]

I fold 5th street your opponent has 4 to a 7 high you have 4 to 9 high. I cant call river without a great read.

[Andy B]

Alchemist, do you have the most current version of the perverter? The link that it automatically generates wasn't right (I edited it). I'm pretty sure that this is a bug that greenage fixed a while back....I also find it curious that the pot size increased by only 1 BB between fifth and sixth.

I'm pretty sure that sixth and seventh are both folds.

[oscillator]

hey this is fear from that same table...i missed that hand but jim had been playing very tight since ft began and him calling an utg complete def is a warning bell...that would be the last person id want calling..5th is a good spot to get away from this hand and calling 6th pretty much obligates you to call 7th. 5th and 6th are the most crucial spots a razzer must learn to save bets imo. nice job!gg!

[Alchemist]

[ QUOTE ]
Alchemist, do you have the most current version of the perverter? The link that it automatically generates wasn't right (I edited it). I'm pretty sure that this is a bug that greenage fixed a while back....I also find it curious that the pot size increased by only 1 BB between fifth and sixth.

I'm pretty sure that sixth and seventh are both folds.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I thought it was odd that the html link it put in there was no good. I updated it pretty recently and I admit I didn't check the output with a fine tooth comb to make sure it was perfect.

The .exe I used was called FTStudConverter070620
*shrug*

[keebler61]

Assuming he's got two babies in the hole here, which I would assume unless you've got a good read on the guy, you're behind like 62 - 38 on 5th here when I ran it through http://www.propokertools.com/simulat...tionEditor.jsp

I think 5th is really edgy. I don't blame you for calling. On 6th though you may be very well drawing dead. On the river I think you're pretty toasty.

[Metnut]

[ QUOTE ]
hey this is fear from that same table...i missed that hand but jim had been playing very tight since ft began and him calling an utg complete def is a warning bell...that would be the last person id want calling..5th is a good spot to get away from this hand and calling 6th pretty much obligates you to call 7th. 5th and 6th are the most crucial spots a razzer must learn to save bets imo. nice job!gg!

[/ QUOTE ]

yea 5th street is a big spot there... its annoying cause i think i played good all night, but my inexperience in razz hurt me there. i guess i was more hoping he paired or was bluffing than actually thinking he did. sucks when you play poker for 3 hours and choke during the biggest hand of the tourney.

[oscillator]

or get coolered by YOU with AA nut flush vs JJ ( flush ) and then blow out to a rivered gutshot. you played well bro, post tourney regrets are no fun! see you soon.

[keebler61]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
hey this is fear from that same table...i missed that hand but jim had been playing very tight since ft began and him calling an utg complete def is a warning bell...that would be the last person id want calling..5th is a good spot to get away from this hand and calling 6th pretty much obligates you to call 7th. 5th and 6th are the most crucial spots a razzer must learn to save bets imo. nice job!gg!

[/ QUOTE ]

yea 5th street is a big spot there... its annoying cause i think i played good all night, but my inexperience in razz hurt me there. i guess i was more hoping he paired or was bluffing than actually thinking he did. sucks when you play poker for 3 hours and choke during the biggest hand of the tourney.

[/ QUOTE ]Well you still cashed though didn't you? I think that it'd be a good thing that you got so far in the tournament while being, as you say, inexperienced. It shows that maybe down the road with a little work you can be winning these.