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#11
02-19-2007, 12:08 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] It doesn't matter if you are making him play correctly if you have no better option. Don't worry about what is correct for him. Worry about what is best for you. This usually means avoiding going broke, even if this costs you a little bit of chip EV. 
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#12
02-19-2007, 12:09 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? [/ QUOTE ] There are a couple of reasons. 1) He doesn't always get to play perfect against us. For instance, in addition to medium pairs I like to stop-n'go with hands like KQ. You can often make AK and AQ fold incorrectly postflop. 2) Two overcards against a medium pair benefits greatly from seeing all five cards. All-in preflop is a race; denying the turn and river is a big advantage even if it sometimes lets someone play perfectly against us.
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#13
02-19-2007, 12:33 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] In Bones example folding is bad for villian. He's getting > 4:1 and has six outs.
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#14
02-19-2007, 12:51 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] What if he has pocket 8's and we have 7's and the flop is A K 10? If we had pushed pre flop he would have called, but he almost certainly has to fold now. Lets assume we have enough chips he is only getting 3-1. He is not playing perfectly against us now.
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#15
02-19-2007, 01:11 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] In Bones example folding is bad for villian. He's getting > 4:1 and has six outs. [/ QUOTE ] 4:1 how? You're shoving 1100 into a 1950 pot, so he has to call 1100 to win 3050. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
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#16
02-19-2007, 01:17 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] In Bones example folding is bad for villian. He's getting > 4:1 and has six outs. [/ QUOTE ] 4:1 how? You're shoving 1100 into a 1950 pot, so he has to call 1100 to win 3050. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] 800. Stack amts are generally listed as preposting.
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#17
02-19-2007, 01:45 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
I never use it also but the idea is, when you have absolutly no FE preflop, to gain a smalish % of FE on the flop when villan has not hit. [/ QUOTE ] I very rarely use, b/c it seems when I do, villain always hits [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]
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#18
02-19-2007, 01:51 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
The theory behind it is this- Say you have a decent hand out of the blinds and someone in lp makes a raise. Your stack is such that you are likely to have no FE preflop. [/ QUOTE ] Hmm, maybe it never worked b/c I did not have a good hand... I just got to the point of desperation, maybe 3-5xbb, so I did SnG. Oh well, I used to do it way too much... I am def playing better now that I very rarely do it...
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#19
02-19-2007, 01:52 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] In Bones example folding is bad for villian. He's getting > 4:1 and has six outs. [/ QUOTE ] Fortunately for us we can sometimes count on some bad folds from Villain as well.
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#20
02-19-2007, 01:57 PM
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Re: Please explain the stop-and-go to me.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Bones, in your example it would seem you're giving him the opportunity to make a correct fold, no? He gets to choose whether he wants to continue. You're just shoving it in blind. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah...it's a sit n go. You should be doing exactly this about 200x/day. [/ QUOTE ] But.. you're letting him play well. He folds when he and calls when he should. Why is this a good thing for us? I guess you could change the example so that he is getting odds to draw to 6 outs, but you're probably getting called (correctly) then. [/ QUOTE ] Im not an expert at this play. However, in Bones' example it seems we're all giving the villain credit for knowing we're on a medium pair. Unless I knew the Hero's game, I wouldnt like to be calling with KJ on an A high board unless getting massive odds.
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