Pushing with overcards

HermannTL · #1 11-27-2007, 05:09 PM

PokerStars 0.02/0.04 Hold'em (10 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero calls, 5 folds, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, CO calls, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, CO calls.

River: (5.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 5.50 BB

I feel like I have a hand similar to this near the beginning of each session: good starting cards, miss the flop, push to see if anyone pushes back. Sometimes--even often--they all crumble, but if they don't I have to decide whether to go to showdown with overcards.

In this case the middle pair on the flop seems good for me as there are slightly fewer cards that are improved by that flop. I push, all but one fold, and I have no reads whatsoever since I'm new to the table. Villains at the levels I'm playing (.10/.20 and lower) often fold to a turn bet, this one didn't. So the last question is whether I pay one more bet to make a note about the villain. Usually I pay that bet, this time I decided not to, more or less by coin flip.

Am I leaking badly here? The alternative approach to the flop would be something like: 1 or 2 other players, bet, 4 or more players, check, 3 players, go by reads or table texture or coin flip. With one unknown left on the turn it feels right to bet.

OK, about that ATs, it's a call on my starting hand chart. It's very likely that I will soon switch that to a raise. If I had raised UTG then the flop decision probably would have involved only one or two other players...which this time would probably have brought me to the same turn decision.

LukeSLTS · #2 11-27-2007, 05:14 PM

There were no draws on the flop. The villain is not going to call the flop and turn and then donk the river with a hand worse than yours. Let this one go.

As far as when to call with ace high and when to fold, flipping a coin is not going to be the optimal strategy. More likely would be examining the board for possible missed draws that are trying to steal the pot.

neurotiq · #3 11-27-2007, 06:01 PM

Raise it preflop.

c/c the flop and fold the turn unimproved.

Sarge85 · #4 11-27-2007, 06:20 PM

I'm not sure I even bother with this hand. I'd check the flop and probably just fold to a bet.

There are going to be better spots than this for you.

Sarge[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Daniel Magix · #5 11-27-2007, 06:46 PM

UTG, I raise this PF.

Get away from it after the flop. I think making a habit out of plays like this, will cost you a lot of bets in the long run - particulary in .02/04.

HermannTL · #6 11-28-2007, 04:42 PM

I assume you mean because it's hard to get people to fold to a bet at .02/.04. I'm more concerned about leaks that cost me a lot of bets at higher levels (if my current BR level of .10/.20 can remotely be called "higher"). I think this area may be a major leak in my game since these situations come up so often. That's why I'm looking at it so much.