LETS GET SOME DISCUSSION... JJ and my pre and post flop play - Page 2

Spanky1974 · #11 08-31-2007, 01:47 AM

SB 3bet pf and b3bai on flop. I don't really see what you beat here except maybe AK, TT and a complete bluff. As played, I think calling is kinda spewy.

corsakh · #12 08-31-2007, 01:59 AM

I really don't like it preflop since your purposely putting yourself in a tough spot. If I think he is 3betting light I raise it since I really hate to see a flop with JJ. If he is not I fold without much thought. Given your read he is a maniac, I 4bet preflop and obviously call a push.

Postflop discussion from someone with your number of posts makes me laugh. WTF.

orange · #13 08-31-2007, 02:16 AM

looks like a pretty easy flop call once you raise. maniac/nice board/rr-ed pot/invested alot = instacall.

kaz2107 · #14 08-31-2007, 07:46 AM

kinda wut i was expecting. seems everyone is split. i would love to hear a range or two that people put villian on throughout the hand. both preflop and then after the shove. imma go pwn some math classes and then come back and give some of my thoughts after the fact.

scallop · #15 08-31-2007, 08:08 AM

[ QUOTE ]
looks like a pretty easy flop call once you raise. maniac/nice board/rr-ed pot/invested alot = instacall.

[/ QUOTE ]

bozzer · #16 08-31-2007, 08:20 AM

grunch: calling the shove would be a bad idea imo. your raise looks moderately weak, but given that villains 3b range doesn't seem to be especially wide any 'bluff' probably has 6 outs against you, and I don't think he's bluffing that much.

I'm not sure how much credit you are giving him for being a thinking player though. Is he positionally aware? is he likely to have a tight range because UTG is tight and utg? what does he think your 3b calling range might be?

Basically, I think you have to have some rough answers at least to these questions to consider calling here.

edit after reading posts: hmm 30% equity needed to call. it's close actually.

corsakh · #17 08-31-2007, 08:25 AM

Words "range" and "maniac" do not go well together unless ATC is a range you want.

ps Thanks, thread delivers [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] But I think BBV is a more appropriate place.
pss May be playing with scared money is not such a good idea. Just a thought [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

bozzer · #18 08-31-2007, 08:29 AM

cor, the guy has a 25% pfr and 6% pfrr, and is quite aggro when he is in a hand over a limited sample. he is perfectly rangeable.

mackthefork · #19 08-31-2007, 08:30 AM

[ QUOTE ]
grunch: calling the shove would be a bad idea imo. your raise looks moderately weak, but given that villains 3b range doesn't seem to be especially wide any 'bluff' probably has 6 outs against you, and I don't think he's bluffing that much.

I'm not sure how much credit you are giving him for being a thinking player though. Is he positionally aware? is he likely to have a tight range because UTG is tight and utg? what does he think your 3b calling range might be?

Basically, I think you have to have some rough answers at least to these questions to consider calling here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hate this sort of thing, even the bad players hands can usually be defined to an extremely thin range when they 3 bet preflop (in my experience anyway) if you're calling preflop with JJ there it's for set value only, you might run into a goon with AQ or AK or even the odd smaller pair, but generally they will give you all the action you want when you're behind the range. In the end of the day calling this is just as fishy as those goons calling off all their chips with JJ when it's obvious it can never be good.

Also 4 handed you aint playing that loose at 33/31, and very few people pay attention anyway.

Mack

maciczka · #20 08-31-2007, 08:35 AM

i call it and im ready to reload