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#152
11-21-2007, 12:54 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] So presumably you would support very low or zero taxes for both straight and gay couples and no wasteful benefit or tax credit nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, absolutely. [/ QUOTE ] Then you agree with the original post. Thanks for coming full circle on this one. 
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#153
11-21-2007, 12:56 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
Earlier in the thread
[ QUOTE ] And the answer is yes. I have no problem with the tax breaks for married couples filing jointly. I have 3 kids of my own. Kids cost a fortune. [/ QUOTE ] Now... [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] So presumably you would support very low or zero taxes for both straight and gay couples and no wasteful benefit or tax credit nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, absolutely. [/ QUOTE ] Does not compute.
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#154
11-21-2007, 12:57 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
Ok I cant be quiet any longer. Re: State interest: The legitimate state interest here is the continuance of a stable population base in the United States. As such, the union of a heterosexual union is the most likely way this is going to happen. No its not the only way so please dont throw that strawman out there. Re: Marriage The state isnt creating marriage. You can get married in a church that will do and you can call yourself married all you want, you can tell everyone that your same sex partner is your husband. What the state is doing is a recognizing a particular form of marriage that it believes is most beneficial to state interests. As such, it provides a variety of benefits to that institution. There are people going ZOMG its discrimination, but the government already discriminates in a number of ways, one of which springs to mind is certain programs that benefit minority business owners. Also, the family is the basic social unit of our society and the government has interest in promoting the form of that we have discovered to be the most effective over thousands of years. Re: Subsidizing marriage: Its funny how there are so many posters who are quick to point out the economic effects of subsidies when the discussion is about other things, but as soon as we start takling about marriage, its suddenly as if the causal link doesnt exist anymore. Dont be willfully blind in this regard. Sure many people will still have children. Anyhow, not sure if I will respond to any replies as I've dicussed this ad nauseum on this forum before and I'm not too keen on rehashing it. [/ QUOTE ] Save this post stick it up here every few months as needed. Won't do any good but it makes too much sense to ignore.
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#155
11-21-2007, 01:03 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
Ok I cant be quiet any longer. Re: State interest: The legitimate state interest here is the continuance of a stable population base in the United States. As such, the union of a heterosexual union is the most likely way this is going to happen. No its not the only way so please dont throw that strawman out there. Re: Marriage The state isnt creating marriage. You can get married in a church that will do and you can call yourself married all you want, you can tell everyone that your same sex partner is your husband. What the state is doing is a recognizing a particular form of marriage that it believes is most beneficial to state interests. As such, it provides a variety of benefits to that institution. There are people going ZOMG its discrimination, but the government already discriminates in a number of ways, one of which springs to mind is certain programs that benefit minority business owners. Also, the family is the basic social unit of our society and the government has interest in promoting the form of that we have discovered to be the most effective over thousands of years. Re: Subsidizing marriage: Its funny how there are so many posters who are quick to point out the economic effects of subsidies when the discussion is about other things, but as soon as we start takling about marriage, its suddenly as if the causal link doesnt exist anymore. Dont be willfully blind in this regard. Sure many people will still have children. Anyhow, not sure if I will respond to any replies as I've dicussed this ad nauseum on this forum before and I'm not too keen on rehashing it. [/ QUOTE ] How would you respond to this: The state has a legitimate state interest in a stable population. The best way to do that is through single-race unions. Bi-racial couples and their children have a difficult time in society (leading to instability) so the state has an interest in decreasing the likelihood of biracial children by only allowing same race marriages. Would you support same race marriage laws? Why/Why Not?
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#156
11-21-2007, 01:04 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
But like many conservatives, you are all for using the govt to impose beliefs and selective benefits and not leave people alone when it is doing something that jives with your personal value system. Hypocrisy ftw. [/ QUOTE ] I believe in small government, period. And as for my personal values. Well, I hate to point it out, but my personal values coincide with those values that our nation was founded upon. As time went along, we forgot what those values were.  I want to go back to the left side of this graph, please.
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#157
11-21-2007, 01:05 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] So presumably you would support very low or zero taxes for both straight and gay couples and no wasteful benefit or tax credit nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, absolutely. [/ QUOTE ] Then you agree with the original post. Thanks for coming full circle on this one. [/ QUOTE ] OP wants to increase gov't spending by expanding benefits. So, no.
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#158
11-21-2007, 01:07 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
Earlier in the thread [ QUOTE ] And the answer is yes. I have no problem with the tax breaks for married couples filing jointly. I have 3 kids of my own. Kids cost a fortune. [/ QUOTE ] Now... [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] So presumably you would support very low or zero taxes for both straight and gay couples and no wasteful benefit or tax credit nonsense. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, absolutely. [/ QUOTE ] Does not compute. [/ QUOTE ] The law is in place for the reasons vulturesrow explained. I agree with following the law. I wish the law didn't have to exist.
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#159
11-21-2007, 01:08 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
And as for my personal values. Well, I hate to point it out, but my personal values coincide with those values that our nation was founded upon. As time went along, we forgot what those values were. [/ QUOTE ] So you don't want the govt to leave people alone as you claimed, but want your values enforced by the govt. Got it. And nice tangent on the spending issue.
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#160
11-21-2007, 01:09 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
OP wants to increase gov't spending by expanding benefits. [/ QUOTE ] No. You're getting closer on this one, and I know there are parts of the OP that are worded awkwardly, but here's the most relevant part of the original post: [ QUOTE ] Legally stop recognizing all forms of marriage. [/ QUOTE ]
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Linear Mode
