Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

[MicroBob]

sillysal - nlnut's case was kind of a famous one that involved him and his friends playing in the same room in a frightingly similar style.
There were many even on here who were convinced he and his friends were using bots at least part of the time and I think were actually NOT happy to hear that he got his money back.

Anyway, only he knows exactly what he did or didn't do but in spite of an earlier post which he eventually deleted he did have some ideas as to what FT was investigating regardless of the communication or lack thereof with him.

[MrGatorade]

It might be because you use 2 accounts...
grego777 and pokergirl z


-Crazy Mike

[nlnut]

[ QUOTE ]


Were they in contact with you or did they just contact you when they unfroze your account?

[/ QUOTE ]


They only contacted me to send in ID. I had to initiate every other communication.
[ QUOTE ]
Did they assure you that they would never freeze your account again?



[/ QUOTE ]
No, they said if new evidence came to light they would freeze it again.

[ QUOTE ]
Are you worried that they will do it again?



[/ QUOTE ] no .... however, I keep minimum in there too play with just in case.

[ QUOTE ]
Going through this has been extremely stressful.


[/ QUOTE ] I know how you feel. It's not fair the way they don't tell you [censored].

[ QUOTE ]
Are you still playing there and do you feel safe?



[/ QUOTE ] I am still playing there. Not as safe as before all of this but safe enough to just keep a few K on there. no way 27k will ever be in there again.

[Rek]

This thread is seriously interesting now. Beforehand, I was very understanding of how an investigation could take so long and I had no problem with the freezing of sillysal’s account whilst this was undertaken. Better timescales should have been given by FTP as to the length of time the process was to take but apart from that I had no real problem as you know.

There is now a resolution with FTP confiscating the $47K and redistributing the money to “wronged” players.

In all disputes there can never be 100% certainty otherwise it is not a dispute but fact. Decisions will have to be made on the old “beyond all reasonable doubt” concept and it seems as though FTP is acting in this way.

• Is this right? Yes I think it is.
• Should FTP now have to back up their evidence? Absolutely, IMHO.
• Should sillysal be able to challenge FTP? Absolutely.

What the online poker industry needs is an appeal committee made up of representatives from the sites themselves, some high profile pros and independent bodies such as 2+2, Pocket Fives, etc. In a situation like this, FTP should be compelled to send their evidence to such a committee for an independent review. If FTP’s actions are upheld then the only recourse would be court action on the part of the player.

I think the committee should be paid for by a proportion of the rake that each site takes. This would do a few things:

• Give a certain legitimacy to online poker that may indeed pacify a lot of the people that object to the game.
• Give players a degree of comfort that they can appeal if they feel they have a strong grievance.
• Any site not signing up to be bound by the independent review could be boycotted by players. If players continued to play elsewhere they do so with the knowledge they have no recourse - don’t come crying with unfair complaints.

My take on this matter is that I believe FTP has undertaken a thorough review and that sillysal was guilty of wrongdoing. Without concrete evidence my reasons are:

• Sillysal’s account was obviously flagged for attention to security at FTP for whatever reason.
• Sillysal must have been generating huge volumes of rake and FTP would not want to lose this kind of income for no good reason.
• $47K is a big amount for an individual. It is peanuts to a major site like FTP and the only conclusion I can draw is that they have serious issues surrounding sillysal’s account.
• They are certainly not doing it to gain an extra $47K profit. Probably her rake amount per annum came to more than this.
• With the flak being generated in the direction of FTP here at 2+2 it would have been easy to have said they had investigated and cleared sillysal. They haven’t taken that option.

Could FTP have made an error? Of course. I can only go on what is said on these forums but to me I would have to assume that sillysal is guilty of something.

However, FTP should give sillysal a way of countering any claims against her. Come on FTP stand up and do the right thing. Show us you care about your players and let us know how we can be sure our innocent accounts will not be blocked and our money taken. Although I would sooner trust FTP than an unknown poster there is always the possibility sillysal is on the receiving end of some very bad judgement.

As the old saying goes “justice must not only be done, it must be seen to be done”

[Greg Miller]

[ QUOTE ]

As the old saying goes “justice must not only be done, it must be seen to be done”

[/ QUOTE ]

Good choice of quotes. It nicely sums up the complaint that most people in this thread have with the way FTP conducts business.

[Rek]

cliff notes:

sillysal posts that FTP are being very nasty
bandwagon starts to roll
ftp are evil devils
oops ftp catch thieving cheating bstards
lets not give ftp any credit anyway
ftp are evil evil people
yeah but ftp still handled it poorly lets beat up ftp anyway
damn what did ftp do wrong - dont know
ftp must be guilty of something
lets hate ftp anyway

[BurnleyMik]

[ QUOTE ]
cliff notes:

sillysal posts that FTP are being very nasty
bandwagon starts to roll
ftp are evil devils
oops ftp catch thieving cheating bstards
lets not give ftp any credit anyway
ftp are evil evil people
yeah but ftp still handled it poorly lets beat up ftp anyway
damn what did ftp do wrong - dont know
ftp must be guilty of something
lets hate ftp anyway

[/ QUOTE ]

You think the way they handled everything was ok? You would be happy of that treatment if you were innocent (I am not sal is or isn't), but some people they freeze accounts of are innocent and they still have to deal with this poor CS department.

[Bobo Fett]

[ QUOTE ]
Strangely biased cliff notes:

sillysal posts that FTP are being very nasty
bandwagon starts to roll
ftp are evil devils
oops ftp catch thieving cheating bstards
lets not give ftp any credit anyway
ftp are evil evil people
yeah but ftp still handled it poorly lets beat up ftp anyway
damn what did ftp do wrong - dont know
ftp must be guilty of something
lets hate ftp anyway

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP.

[Wahoo73]

Deja vu all over again?!?!

sillysal=BeatMe1?????

[FTPSean]

2+2ers,

While I prefer to keep my comments on individual cases to PMs, I'd like to address some of the issues in this thread.

Until an investigation is complete, unfortunately, we cannot release any information about the case to anyone, not even the players involved. If we disclose details of a case before it is complete, we may be jeopardizing future progress or developments in the case. In the long run, keeping the information confidential protects the innocent players involved and protects our players by allowing us to gather “untainted” information in regards to our investigation.

The time it takes us to complete an investigation really depends on how long it takes to receive the information required from other parties, such as credit card companies, payment processors and other players. While we send frequent reminders to anyone we are waiting on, they may take a few days to respond which delays the investigation. Furthermore, a non-response from other players involved is information in and of itself, but it can take a number of days to determine a non-response. Basically, the turnaround time of an investigation can also be affected by those involved.

Having said that, I agree that we should meet any specific time frames that are communicated.

sillysal, I'm sorry that you were not initially contacted within the time you were told. I want you to know that we have since stressed the importance of communicating proper information to our players, and to not just tell them something to appease them. While we couldn’t always provide you with new information on your case, our records show that we replied to all of your emails within 24 hours (except for duplicate emails). Even when we couldn’t say anything that you hadn’t already heard, we always answered your emails with as much detail as we could give. We will always contact you as soon as we have any new information, which is why we have asked you to avoid asking the same questions over again.

I realize that you have a large amount of funds in your account, and I am truly sorry that you cannot access these funds right now. Unfortunately, prior evidence has shown that a player’s tenure and account balance do not correlate to the findings of an investigation. While we do make an effort to prioritize high profile cases, we also work to resolve all investigations as quickly as possible.

I do want to reiterate that we do not take account suspensions and investigations lightly. We realize the importance of freezing a player’s bankroll, and do not take that course of action without reasonable cause.

Sean