25NL AK hand 300bb deep - Page 3

slush420 · #21 10-18-2007, 10:26 AM

I would call any river that's less than $20. Above that and I strongly consider folding. He's definitely not bluffing, but an aggression factor of 2 means he is capable of doing this with worse kings.

21SuicideKing21 · #22 10-18-2007, 10:41 AM

Why are we folding this hand? I call turn, and see what he does on the river. Only hands I'm putting this guy on that beats us is A3 or 77. Do any of you guys put him on KQ? While it is deep, I would still play cautious and will call a river bet of 15-20 here. I seriously think you're losing way too much value out of this by folding.

kroeliewoelie · #23 10-18-2007, 10:44 AM

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Against a range of KK+,K3,K7,33,77,AK,KQ,KJ we still have 45% equity. Although of course a large part from this equity comes from KQ,KJ. Removing them from the range gives an equity of 16%. (Where 10% comes from including AK for a split). But even with only KQ we still have 30% equity, enough to call his minraise.

So only in the most pessimistic scenario (for us) his raise his large enough to deny us to odds to call. Being a little more optimistic and iven that we have position, I am inclined to call here and call any river bet up to half the pot.

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I am not sure I understand this right. This means it's ok to call. Does this mean we can also call a river bet UI? Or are we just calling to catch a K or A?

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I think you need to be be almost drawing dead before you can fold to his minraise. You are getting great odds and you have a decent hand. By calling you are saying: I am not folding to any minraise, show me what you have on the river. You also say you are still quite sure of your hand, so he will probably fire big with the hands that crush you and check or fire small (<0.5 psb) with KJ and KQ. That's why I am calling small bets UI and folding to large bets.

ICMoney · #24 10-18-2007, 10:48 AM

There's no way you can fold to that tiny raise.

Your are IP on river.

Pot will be $27 on river.

I'd prob call around $20 or so.

IJackit · #25 10-18-2007, 10:52 AM

I aggree. Any King is in his PF range including K7.

His range is wide enough and his stats aggressive enough post flop that I would consider a fold to be bad here.

Milky · #26 10-18-2007, 12:22 PM

What do you guys think about a turn check? It gets you paid off by weaker hands when you (or villain) bet river and loses less when you're behind.

Shoe Lace · #27 10-18-2007, 04:21 PM

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What do you guys think about a turn check? It gets you paid off by weaker hands when you (or villain) bet river and loses less when you're behind.

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Seems reasonable on this specific board.

If he checks the river, you can bet and effortlessly call a min raise.
If he bets the river (normal size), you can still call.

Get some value when you win and lose the least you can when you're behind.

Only problem I see is that you can't narrow villain's range with a check on the turn. I don't think it's a big issue generally though. It's only a problem when he C/Rs you really big on the river.

bozzer · #28 10-19-2007, 05:31 AM

results/river action?

Das Budrick · #29 10-19-2007, 06:21 AM

Some intersting discussion here, pretty much confirmed how I felt that it should be played. As played, my opponent was quite weak and allowed me to call both turn and river. I thought about posting the river as A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], but decided my action would have been the same regardless. Had he value bet the river properly I probably would've folded.

I don't think I like a turn check here, he is too loose and will call value bets all the way with KX.

Turn: ($7.65) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB raises to $10, Hero calls $5.

River: ($27.65) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $10.5, Hero calls $10.50.

Final Pot: $48.65

Results in white below: 
SB has 3s 6s (three of a kind, threes).
Hero has Ac Kh (two pair, kings and threes).
Outcome: SB wins $48.65.

yegon · #30 10-19-2007, 06:42 AM

If the flop would be K73 rainbow and this was a pure Baluga theorem situation does it change the calling turn to folding turn? Is the fact that there are more 2 pairs (as wicked as they would be) and more sets possible enough to change the decision? Or am I just applying Baluga theorem too religiously?