x-IRS agent famous for protesting the I.T. found Guilty

[Misfire]

[ QUOTE ]
I lack the ecomonic knowledge needed to say whether or not income taxes are necessary for the United States.

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No economic knowledge needed. From 1791 to 1913 we survived without an income tax. If you can manage to get by without something for 120+ years, it's probably not necessary.

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since the vast majority of elected officials have chosen to upheld the income tax and have not challenged it, and since the courts repedatly have stated that the income tax is in line with the constitution I feel no pain for those who are arrested for tax evasion.

...Im not against peaceful civil disobediance, but as long as they brake the current laws of the nation I also think there need to be some penalties handed out to those who choose to go that way.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, it's clearly best for society when violations of unjust laws are punished.


edit: nice freudian slip with the word "brake."

[Bedreviter]

[ QUOTE ]
No economic knowledge needed. From 1791 to 1913 we survived without an income tax. If you can manage to get by without something for 120+ years, it's probably not necessary.

[/ QUOTE ]

Guess you subscribe to the "no economic knowledge needed"-theory yourself as you ignore that there was a federal income tax in place 1862-1872, and 1894-1895.

And I dont know if too many people from todays society will agree with you that those times were better, in regards of schooling, life expectancy, economic growth, poverty and so on. You get by without a lot of things, but it does not mean it is not desireable.

I stated that I lack the economic knowledge to determine whether or not the income tax is needed, but I guess all you need to know is "Does people get by without it?". Wow, had i known macro-economics was so simple I should have taken a different major.

Oh, and nice touch bringing in a picture of a victim of a racist law. I guess it was wrong of me to assume that everyone would understand that I wrote "current laws of the nation" in a situation where I am relatively comfortable with the legal system. I also think there can be situations where I would support an armed uprising against government, is it funny how that works? That Im somehow in favor of punishing those who break the laws of a system that I support and am also in favor of using force to bring down a system that I oppose strongly.

I dont even know how to react to that picture in a thread about tax evasion. Im against the law about drinking alcohol in public, guess I will equate myself to Rosa Parks if a cop busts me for drinking a beer in the park.


[ QUOTE ]
edit: nice freudian slip with the word "brake."

[/ QUOTE ]

Or maybe nice "english is not my first language" slip?

[DblBarrelJ]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I lack the ecomonic knowledge needed to say whether or not income taxes are necessary for the United States.

[/ QUOTE ]

No economic knowledge needed. From 1791 to 1913 we survived without an income tax. If you can manage to get by without something for 120+ years, it's probably not necessary.

[ QUOTE ]
since the vast majority of elected officials have chosen to upheld the income tax and have not challenged it, and since the courts repedatly have stated that the income tax is in line with the constitution I feel no pain for those who are arrested for tax evasion.

...Im not against peaceful civil disobediance, but as long as they brake the current laws of the nation I also think there need to be some penalties handed out to those who choose to go that way.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, it's clearly best for society when violations of unjust laws are punished.


edit: nice freudian slip with the word "brake."

[/ QUOTE ]


You do of course realize that the national publicity MLK gained from photos like this are one of the main reasons the civil rights movement began building momentum, right?

[CORed]

[ QUOTE ]
This is why I think all of the "the inome tax is illegal and/or unconstitutional!" arguments for not paying taxes are foolish. It doesn't matter. They have the guns. Duh.

The way to challenge this income tax is on principles, not [censored] technicalities.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also, decisions about the constitutionality and legality of the income tax are made by federal judges, who derive most of their salaries from income tax. How do you think they're going to decide, especially when there's a constitutional amendment that explicitly permits the income tax?

[Bedreviter]

[ QUOTE ]
Also, decisions about the constitutionality and legality of the income tax are made by federal judges, who derive most of their salaries from income tax. How do you think they're going to decide, especially when there's a constitutional amendment that explicitly permits the income tax?

[/ QUOTE ]

Arent federal judges appointed for life with a salary that cannot be reduced by Congress? Seems like there is little incetive for them to vote in favor of the income tax based on where they get their income. And how do you know that most of their salaries comes from income taxes? They were being paid in full before the income tax was introduced, so I assume the same would be true of the income tax was to disappear.

[Cumulonimbus]

but if you don't agree with their principles then shouldn't you refuse to support such principles, regardless of who's got guns pointed at you? /derail

[bobman0330]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is why I think all of the "the inome tax is illegal and/or unconstitutional!" arguments for not paying taxes are foolish. It doesn't matter. They have the guns. Duh.

The way to challenge this income tax is on principles, not [censored] technicalities.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also, decisions about the constitutionality and legality of the income tax are made by federal judges, who derive most of their salaries from income tax. How do you think they're going to decide, especially when there's a constitutional amendment that explicitly permits the income tax?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah-ha, but aren't all these tax protesters people who have to PAY income tax? Pretty obvious that they're biased too.

[CORed]

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but if you don't agree with their principles then shouldn't you refuse to support such principles, regardless of who's got guns pointed at you? /derail

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe I'm chicken, but if I'm going to try to resist an armed robbery, I want to have a high probability of success. Otherwise, I'm going to give the armed robber(s) my money and stay alive (or out of prison). Against the IRS, I think I have a pretty low probability of success. Besides, while I have no love for the IRS or the US Tax Code, I think government and taxes are a definitely unavoidable, and possibly necessary evil. I would love to see a tax system that was fairer (however one might define that) and certainly simpler, but I'm not an AC, so I really have no desire to go to prison to eliminate or change the tax system.

[Borodog]

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but if you don't agree with their principles then shouldn't you refuse to support such principles, regardless of who's got guns pointed at you? /derail

[/ QUOTE ]

Tell it to the mugger.