10/20 bellagio from a while ago

leon · #1 10-22-2007, 11:10 PM

This hand bugged the crap out of me for a long time... I was just thinking of it today. I'm primarily a limit player FYI and maybe this is simple. Any comments welcome.

10/20 Bellagio. Game seems standard, somewhat LAG. UTG makes it 80 (standard raise for this table). UTG is ok but spews a little, seems to overvalue hands like TP. All fold to me in LP, I make it 300 with AA, 3K behind. Cutoff right behind me cold calls the raise sitting on 8K. UTG thinks briefly and calls with ~4K, all else fold.

Read on cutoff- one of the more LAG players at the table. The table probably sees me as more tight than most, mostly a function of me not having much to play/hitting any hands postflop. I'm giving UTG 99+, A10 suited - AK, maybe KQ suited as a reasonable range. Cutoff's range is wider, but should be reasonable given his double cold call.

Flop- horrible- KKQ rainbow. UTG checks, I check (?) with a plan to evaluate, cutoff checks. Interesting.

Turn- Q, for a board of KKQQ. May have been a two flush out now, can't remember. 900+ in the pot. UTG checks again. I decide to weak lead for 400. My thinking is I can't get played with unless I'm crushed and I can safely fold to a raise. No money goes in on the river unless I hit an ace. Plus, as the reraiser I may have really flopped huge, and my opponents have to give my weak bet a little credit. Cutoff thinks for a little, then announces all in. UTG folds. 2600 to call, 4300 in the pot.

Your action?

THanks

Leon

pnazari · #2 10-22-2007, 11:15 PM

you have a tight image, you took ur shot on the turn...easy fold.

limon · #3 10-22-2007, 11:18 PM

your description of what you did on turn would have worked as well on the flop and not given a free card or induced a bluff you might not want to call...ez fold either way.

leon · #4 10-22-2007, 11:26 PM

so you like a flop bet? I think I checked at the time b/c I was so sure I got outflopped my plan was basically to check/fold. I figured either cutoff or UTG outflopped me given the double raise PF. Once the flop got checked around I got my hopes up. Plus my flop check should be viewed as suspicious and my turn bet should not be viewed by them simply as a steal. I do see the merit of not giving a free card or inviting a bluff.

Thanks

Leon

Praetor · #5 10-22-2007, 11:33 PM

I check the turn again, and fold as played

morello · #6 10-22-2007, 11:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
My thinking is I can't get played with unless I'm crushed and I can safely fold to a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Cutoff thinks for a little, then announces all in.

[/ QUOTE ]

you already solved the problem?

FoxwoodsFiend · #7 10-22-2007, 11:36 PM

betting this turn is lighting Gbucks on fire.

don't give $400 to all better hands just to avoid feeling like a wuss when you check/fold AA on a KKQQ board in a 3bet 3way pot. either comfortably fold b/c you have a read or comfortably check/call one street if you don't think he's bluffy but please don't bet/fold here.

leon · #8 10-22-2007, 11:37 PM

Yeah, I hated my hand so much I seriously thought about doing that. I thought checking twice was too much though in terms of inviting a bluff.

Leon

leon · #9 10-22-2007, 11:40 PM

Thanks.

So you c/c or c/f the turn? How big of a bet are you willing to call assuming cutoff bets and UTG folds? If you're an idiot like me and bet the turn to you fold to the shove?

Leon

FoxwoodsFiend · #10 10-22-2007, 11:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks.

So you c/c or c/f the turn? How big of a bet are you willing to call assuming cutoff bets and UTG folds? If you're an idiot like me and bet the turn to you fold to the shove?

Leon

[/ QUOTE ]

obviously live it all depends on your read. against an unknown i'd probably c/c turn once with my "i could be slowplaying" hesitation move and suspiciously slow check motion and c/f river

easy fold on turn