$75 TURBO MTT

[ForRealDD]

Our M is 3.8. Standard shove, or fold? This is a turbo tournament.

Full Tilt Poker Game #3129833151: $18,000 Guarantee (23871702), Table 32 - 1200/2400 Ante 300 - No Limit Hold'em - 3:45:05 ET - 2007/08/02
Seat 1: DallasRounder (21,811)
Seat 2: _ll_ausar_ll_ (34,949)
Seat 3: dolohov (32,220)
Seat 4: LUCKY FOX (25,241)
Seat 6: EVOGO2HELL (33,317)
Seat 7: boredddddddddd (59,741)
Seat 9: Grave Danger3 (55,923)
DallasRounder antes 300
_ll_ausar_ll_ antes 300
dolohov antes 300
LUCKY FOX antes 300
EVOGO2HELL antes 300
boredddddddddd antes 300
Grave Danger3 antes 300
LUCKY FOX posts the small blind of 1,200
EVOGO2HELL posts the big blind of 2,400
The button is in seat #3
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DallasRounder [Qd 8d]
boredddddddddd folds
Grave Danger3 folds
DallasRounder ??

[Tackleberry]

I would shove. If you get called, you should have a good chance not to be dominated.

[chh]

you have an M of 4, are in the BB again soon, 2 ppl have already folded and you have a somewhat decent hand and your stack could hurt the BB a lot... why even ask :P

[kommunizt]

you shoved and lost.

standard.

[levAA]

borderline but a fold.

its slight -EV

only on a very tight table this turns up to be +EV but still borderline.

[chh]

this cant possible be a fold, we have only 2 more hands before we're in the BB again. I'm not saying it's +cEV, but it's a risk we *have* to take here

[levAA]

[ QUOTE ]
this cant possible be a fold, we have only 2 more hands before we're in the BB again. I'm not saying it's +cEV, but it's a risk we *have* to take here

[/ QUOTE ]

i don't understand your argument, if it is not +EV it's a bad move. you have 9BB and a M of about 4, this means you are looking for spot to move in.
lower M means your opening requirements go down because the blinds get larger compared to your stack.
it doesn't mean that you should move your chips in in -EV situations.
if you pass the blinds and are in the same situation next orbit this becomes a clear push - cause your M is down to 3.

[Tackleberry]

[ QUOTE ]
borderline but a fold.

its slight -EV

only on a very tight table this turns up to be +EV but still borderline.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you underlay this?

I made some very rough (!) calculation and it seems that it gets breakeven if all of the remaining opponents have a calling-range of 20% or higher. With 15% it already slightly gets +EV (~ 1k) and I don´t expect 15% to be overly tight ...

[levAA]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
borderline but a fold.

its slight -EV

only on a very tight table this turns up to be +EV but still borderline.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you underlay this?

I made some very rough (!) calculation and it seems that it gets breakeven if all of the remaining opponents have a calling-range of 20% or higher. With 15% it already slightly gets +EV (~ 1k) and I don´t expect 15% to be overly tight ...

[/ QUOTE ]

made the calculations with "SnG Power Tools" with tight, loose and a mix of opponents.
only with all the opponents being tight it becomes +EV - and here just about 0,2%