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  #41  
Old 11-13-2007, 03:33 PM
Yads Yads is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

I think it's just a call.
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  #42  
Old 11-13-2007, 03:33 PM
HOWMANY HOWMANY is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]


We 3bet/call because it's +EV.


[/ QUOTE ]

thats exactly what i said, this is just my new way of posting lazily, i cant really justify putting effort into well thought out posts any more when people are suggesting [censored] like checking this flop. we 3bet because anything else would be dumb, we call the 4th bet because the other guy is dumb and very likely doesnt understand the strength of his hand. i wasnt implying that we should spite call if we get 4bet i just meant that instead of making a heroic laydown we have enough reason to believe there are a solid amount of worse hands in his range that we can call a 4th bet here easily. this is also probably one of those spots where 3betting is the most profitable play even if we were to call and lose 100% of the time that we are 4bet which im almost certain isnt the case.
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  #43  
Old 11-13-2007, 03:44 PM
MitchL MitchL is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

I really dont like 3betting here. I can only think of 2hands that we are ahead of that called 3 cold pf and that is AA and JhTh. If this guy is at all "thinking" as PJ says he wont be smoothcalling the turn in position w/ a Jhigh flush. Now if this guy were just a complete spewlag then i could see some merit to raising, but if we get 4bet by someone with any sense we are beat. Give PJs other descriptors I dont really buy that this guy is a thinking lag, but I do believe that he is not completely retarded. Only a terrible player would not raise either JTh or AA on the turn.
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  #44  
Old 11-13-2007, 04:17 PM
ShawnHoo ShawnHoo is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

Here's button's thought process with a set:

"ZOMG I flopped a set. I will be really tricky and wait to raise the turn."

"Crap, now there are three hearts. Stupid dealer kill me every time! I will just call here and try to fill up."

"Full house! Yay! I raise!"
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  #45  
Old 11-14-2007, 08:23 AM
Adebisi Adebisi is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]
I can only think of 2hands that we are ahead of that called 3 cold pf and that is AA and JhTh.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
A very strange player takes 3 to the face on the button. He's been playing incredibly aggressive preflop and then spazzy post-flop,

[/ QUOTE ]

This guy's a nutjob. He doesn't have just AA or JTs. He has 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or 95o.
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  #46  
Old 11-14-2007, 01:59 PM
Hielko Hielko is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

Not 3-betting here is so weird, it suprises me that so many people think about calling. You have the second nut flush (at the very top of you're range here, the only better hands you can have are AJs+ and 99), there has not been a lot of action yet (single bet on the flop, single bet on the turn) and you are playing against an erradic player.
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  #47  
Old 11-14-2007, 02:06 PM
private joker private joker is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]


This guy's a nutjob. He doesn't have just AA or JTs. He has 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] or 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or 95o.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty good read. He had 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Unfortunately I just called, with the same reasoning Andyfox had in his post. I find it interesting that the forum was split down the middle on 3-betting or calling. I guess it really was as close and difficult as I suspected. Probably means it didn't matter too much. But I do feel like he would have cry-called a 3-bet. He really must have put me on QQ+ the way I played the hand and was sure his trips were good.
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  #48  
Old 11-14-2007, 10:40 PM
Adebisi Adebisi is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately I just called, with the same reasoning Andyfox had in his post. I find it interesting that the forum was split down the middle on 3-betting or calling. I guess it really was as close and difficult as I suspected. Probably means it didn't matter too much. But I do feel like he would have cry-called a 3-bet. He really must have put me on QQ+ the way I played the hand and was sure his trips were good.



[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe the split is along the lines of primarily live players and people who have played a good amount online. I've played my share of both, and I think many live players don't really have a good grasp of the hand ranges of donkish aggressive/spazzy players, since they don't play a lot of hands against them and don't get to see all their hands at showdown.
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  #49  
Old 11-15-2007, 03:27 AM
Sailboats Sailboats is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately I just called, with the same reasoning Andyfox had in his post. I find it interesting that the forum was split down the middle on 3-betting or calling. I guess it really was as close and difficult as I suspected. Probably means it didn't matter too much. But I do feel like he would have cry-called a 3-bet. He really must have put me on QQ+ the way I played the hand and was sure his trips were good.



[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe the split is along the lines of primarily live players and people who have played a good amount online. I've played my share of both, and I think many live players don't really have a good grasp of the hand ranges of donkish aggressive/spazzy players, since they don't play a lot of hands against them and don't get to see all their hands at showdown.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aren't most of the people that are advocating 3-bet live players?
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  #50  
Old 11-15-2007, 08:34 AM
chesspain chesspain is offline
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Default Re: Bizarre river raise

[ QUOTE ]

A fairly loose-aggressive player opens in EP; I 3-bet in the hijack with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].


[/ QUOTE ]

Let's talk for a moment about PF. Since this is presumably an isolation move, do you believe that you are ahead of his range here? And if not, are you assuming that you will be able to use your position to get him to fold when the board misses you and either he has a mid-PP or A-high?
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