$16s - 200/400, 88 on BB with minraise and caller

[Kevin8423]

I was completely lost here, I'm pretty sure a call isn't good even if its only 400 into this big pot. Folding could be correct as I don't think my 88 will be too great against their holdings (likely flipping or beat) and I don't see them folding all that often. So should I be folding here or is the push good?

PokerStars Tournament, Big Blind is t400 with t25 antes (5 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

UTG (t1865)
CO (t2105)
Button (t3200)
SB (t3860)
Hero (t2470)

Preflop: Hero is in BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
<font color="gray">UTG folds</font>, <font color="red">CO raises to t800</font>, Button calls t800, <font color="gray">SB folds</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to t2445 (All-in)</font>

[RexWoo]

The min raise is scary, the call is super strange and I doubt you have FE but I would push if CO is unknown / bad (stats please), fold otherwise.

[bonycamel]

My option would be call. If flop had no 8, check/fold

[Kevin8423]

They are both random 16s players, going to sleep now so I don't feel like looking up their stats but just assume they are both standard players (meaning borderline retarded). At the time I was fairly sure the minraise was not a monster hand, but was thinking I probably don't get two folds that often. On the upside, the pot is enormous so flipping is good (while being dominated by higher PPs is obviously still not).

[RexWoo]

I think flipping is fine too + you will probably get only one caller. If their range is big, I think the push is good.

[doubLe a tom]

You post some tough hands. They make my head hurt a little.

Im honestly not sure what I would do here. I probably fold most of the time, and then push atc when I can. Ask me on Wednesday or Friday and I'll probably have a better answer.

[Jago]

[ QUOTE ]
My option would be call. If flop had no 8, check/fold

[/ QUOTE ]
This can't be +EV. There's t2325 in the pot before you act, and it costs you t400, offering less than 6:1. and iirc you flop a set 1 in 8.5 times. You have 6BB, thus not offering implied odds.

I think we're really only worried about CO minraising here, there's virtually no hand BTN could have here that would make cold-calling a good play. I wished we knew more about CO, even if it's their PT stats.

IMO 99/TT feels like the neutral EV point (I have no evidence to back this up, at all) but I could see a point made for pushing with the overlay.

In conclusion kevin, nfi.

edit: just read the responses, if you feel the minraise isn't an indication of strength then pooooooosh

[blackize]

[ QUOTE ]

This can't be +EV. There's t2325 in the pot before you act, and it costs you t400, offering less than 6:1. and iirc you flop a set 1 in 8.5 times. You have 6BB, thus not offering implied odds.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually in pure chip EV it is +EV. You can combine pot odds and implied odds. You're getting 5.75:1 preflop leaving just another 3 or so BBs to squeak out when you hit.

[Jago]

orly, how does that work? Is there a post somewhere where it explains this?

[fluorescenthippo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

This can't be +EV. There's t2325 in the pot before you act, and it costs you t400, offering less than 6:1. and iirc you flop a set 1 in 8.5 times. You have 6BB, thus not offering implied odds.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually in pure chip EV it is +EV. You can combine pot odds and implied odds. You're getting 5.75:1 preflop leaving just another 3 or so BBs to squeak out when you hit.

[/ QUOTE ]

yea but you will lose sometimes iwth your set, esp vs 2 people.


the hand is close, id push 99. if i thought BB was calling loose because hes stupid id push