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  #11  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:28 PM
BarryLyndon BarryLyndon is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

I feel like you guys are all quoting from a textbook to problem #42 in an econ texbook. Yes, I know, poker is about maximizing EV and minimizing losses, and that's econ and math, but are you sure that 3-betting PF and the flop is best in this particular case:

Is there not something to be said for hiding hand strength in position v. a potential LAG PF with KAo? Or that not RRing on the flop is a reasonable alternative when it's VERY possible I'm facing an CRAI with KdK, KdJ, KdQ, AxJd, or all WB hands (sets) that I'd play against him one street at a time rather than make my decision "I'm either up 55/45 or I'm super behind, I dunno?" And I have NO FE against KdJ and AQ, anyone who plays NL50 knows this. So, why have him get it in with 2 cards here or fold a worse hand that he may try to bluff on the river?

Having said that, I think my biggest mistake was not betting more on the turn. But, I'd love to hear a better explanation than just "maximize EV when you have AK, because that's what we do." Different boards, different players.

Barry
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  #12  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:37 PM
catalyst catalyst is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

PF is bad, flop/turn action is awful. Seriously, as others mentioned, it's NL50 - plenty of villains are calling with dominated hands against AK PF - and AKo plays much better isolated with 1 opponent, in position, than in a multiway pot.
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  #13  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:39 PM
Jay Riall Jay Riall is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

Flop is standard.
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  #14  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:41 PM
shpanko shpanko is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

[ QUOTE ]
PF is bad, flop/turn action is awful. Seriously, as others mentioned, it's NL50 - plenty of villains are calling with dominated hands against AK PF - and AKo plays much better isolated with 1 opponent, in position, than in a multiway pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

THis pretty much says it all. I always, ALWAYS, reraise AKo pf unless I know the opening villain is a complete 11/5 nit. AKo has so much value against villains hand and we want the initiative on the flop.
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  #15  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:45 PM
Austiger Austiger is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

The value lies not in hiding the strength of AK by calling, but by hiding the strength of AK by raising a wide range of hands. You want to raise him with all kinds of hands in position and then steal the pot with a c-bet. Of course you also want to raise with your strong hands for balance.

3-betting AK in position vs. an UTG raiser is just a completely standard play that 95% of the people on this board will make 95% of the time. It's going to be hard to argue against it. (Plus, you want to get the pot heads-up.)
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  #16  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:52 PM
Perseus Perseus is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

[ QUOTE ]
I feel like you guys are all quoting from a textbook to problem #42 in an econ texbook. Yes, I know, poker is about maximizing EV and minimizing losses, and that's econ and math, but are you sure that 3-betting PF and the flop is best in this particular case:

Is there not something to be said for hiding hand strength in position v. a potential LAG PF with KAo? Or that not RRing on the flop is a reasonable alternative when it's VERY possible I'm facing an CRAI with KdK, KdJ, KdQ, AxJd, or all WB hands (sets) that I'd play against him one street at a time rather than make my decision "I'm either up 55/45 or I'm super behind, I dunno?" And I have NO FE against KdJ and AQ, anyone who plays NL50 knows this. So, why have him get it in with 2 cards here or fold a worse hand that he may try to bluff on the river?

Having said that, I think my biggest mistake was not betting more on the turn. But, I'd love to hear a better explanation than just "maximize EV when you have AK, because that's what we do." Different boards, different players.

Barry

[/ QUOTE ]

It sounds like you are getting very defensive and refusing advice because you assume your analysis is superior to others. If you want to post your hands for feedback, then you need to be open to criticism. Instead of saying "blah everyone is quoting from a textbook" you need to say "why is everyones respond so similar? Why are they saying I played this hand so poorly?"

My opinion is thus:

You are really overthinking the 50NL online game. Would villian likely fold preflop to your raise? The answer is probably not, but even if he did that's ok because you have AK which, while in limit can be a strong hand, in NL is very, very dangerous. By not reraising you are putting yourself into a not-so-fun situation with AK. By raising pre and the flop you are getting information out of your opponent which then allows to you make a much more informed decision.

I would suggest you don't think "if I raise I am worried about a reraise, so I'll call." It is more profitable to use the thought line of "I will raise because I have the best hand and want to get value out of the hand, and if I am reraised then I'll re-evaluate my hand at that time."
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  #17  
Old 07-06-2007, 02:57 PM
axioma axioma is offline
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Default Re: 50NL: Interesting hand SSNL may appreciate

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You're getting way to fancy for 50nl, and making it a lot harder to get value from your hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where did I miss value?

[/ QUOTE ]

"I dont want to 3-bet here..."

"I dont really want to raise here..."
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