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#41
09-30-2007, 01:33 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
One approach to this would be your personal experience in which you "have a thought". I'm reminded of a post by DS in which he stated that the thoughts come to a person , more like an experience than a causal connection of "I produce the thought'. More like "I experience the thought". In this light, consideration can be given to "experiencing the thought" in which an individual reacts to this experience it becomes clearer that the idea that Man produces these thoughts becomes questionable. It doesn't answer the question of where the thought "comes from" or whether there is a "thinker' that produces these thoughts but it does lead to Man "experiencing thoughts". Quote: I think it could very well be exactly as a radio or tv station. In the invisibility of combined thought (frequencies) we are like towers in that whatever possible station we tune into, so long as we tune in correctly by getting the math right we get a strong signal... The invention of radio and tv has to be along these lines... Creating virtual reality, within virtual reality... [/ QUOTE ] I have to tell you, never for one moment have I ever considered that I would ever find some agreement with a virtual reality perception but it's close!!! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Never really thought I'd consider myself a radio antenna. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] 
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#42
09-30-2007, 04:37 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
I have to tell you, never for one moment have I ever considered that I would ever find some agreement with a virtual reality perception but it's close!!! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Never really thought I'd consider myself a radio antenna. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] Know what you mean bro, its uh, boggling at times... When I "die", I will have on my gravestone: "Man, he thought himself to death."
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#43
10-01-2007, 11:58 PM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
In his autobiography "The Time of My Life" W.V.O. Quine recounts the time he met Jacques Lacan. According to Quine Lacan spent the entire time asking bewildering and confused questions.
I practice philosophy that is very different methodologically from the tradition that Steiner falls into, and all I can say is that my reaction intellectually to that sort of work is much like Quine's, so I doubt that we have any common ground for further discussion.
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#44
10-02-2007, 06:21 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Could you describe something that isn't part of reality? [/ QUOTE ] Descartes is a philosopher who has been a fundamental influence on Western thought. He is the fellow that came up with the saying "I think therefore I am". He concluded that the essence of humans is thinkinging and that matter and thinking are two seperate realities. We learned from this that there is reality out there and our mind tries to discover what this reality is never thinking that the reality one discovers contains our thought. In other words reality and thought are seperate. [/ QUOTE ] Just because Descartes said it, doesn't make it so. Modern cognitive neuroscience has failed to find any sign of mind existing outside the brain or outside reality. Science and philosophy since Descartes has found no compelling reason to believe that minds are anything more than physical phenomena.
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#45
10-02-2007, 08:35 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
Just because Descartes said it, doesn't make it so. [/ QUOTE ] I would hope that anyone that has done a 101 in logic would see the errors of Descartes way. Going on Descartes knowledge, in his time, the only thing that could be said is "there is thought therefore there is thinking"!
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#47
10-02-2007, 08:49 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Just because Descartes said it, doesn't make it so. [/ QUOTE ] I would hope that anyone that has done a 101 in logic would see the errors of Descartes way. Going on Descartes knowledge, in his time, the only thing that could be said is "there is thought therefore there is thinking"! [/ QUOTE ] Western thought has been greatly influenced by Descartes despite his obvious fallacies.
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#48
10-02-2007, 08:53 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Just because Descartes said it, doesn't make it so. [/ QUOTE ] I would hope that anyone that has done a 101 in logic would see the errors of Descartes way. Going on Descartes knowledge, in his time, the only thing that could be said is "there is thought therefore there is thinking"! [/ QUOTE ] Western thought has been greatly influenced by Descartes despite his obvious fallacies. [/ QUOTE ] So??? If wrong, it is wrong and any deductions from it are wrong too.
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#49
10-02-2007, 10:49 AM
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Re: Thinking is part of reality
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Just because Descartes said it, doesn't make it so. [/ QUOTE ] I would hope that anyone that has done a 101 in logic would see the errors of Descartes way. Going on Descartes knowledge, in his time, the only thing that could be said is "there is thought therefore there is thinking"! [/ QUOTE ] Western thought has been greatly influenced by Descartes despite his obvious fallacies. [/ QUOTE ] So??? If wrong, it is wrong and any deductions from it are wrong too. [/ QUOTE ] True but its Descartes lines of thought that have been so influential not his conclusions. Also unsuccesful attacks at a problem can be very illuminating and useful (in as far as philosophy is useful). Descartes work on knowledge and dualism are two examples of this. chez
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