"The Prestige" wtf? (spoilers)

[peachy]

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Peachy a closet Tesla fan??? Didn't see that one coming.

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Im fulla surprises!!! And always underestimated [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[traz]

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What? As said in this thread, I thought it was pretty clear that an Angier clone was dying in the tank every performance

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So this is the twist of true magic in the movie? Don't you think it's more likely (given that the entire movie is about stage magic and deception, and that Michael Caine character pointedly alludes to the end of the movie being the culmination of a magic trick) that there's a naturalistic explanation? Besides, part of the point of my post was to question how we "know" this. Since nobody but Angier ever discusses the cloning, and the movie is full of magicians keeping ridiculous, over the top secrets to protect their art (the goldfish bowl guy, the Bordens), one has to at least consider that Angier is feeding the clone story as [censored] to conceal the secret of his superior Transported Man act, even as he dies.

If the planned explanation really is "Oh, yeah, you can totally clone things. Duh," then the movie is one hell of an aggravating copout with some nice performances. If the explanation is that there's supposed to be enough evidence to show how the trick was worked within the confines of reality, then the movie rules. My feeling is that it's probably somewhere in between - there is a naturalistic explanation, obviously, but we aren't given quite enough in the movie to construct it, and need to fill in the blanks ourselves.

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I figured the theme was there is no "easy way" in magic. Angier tried to find an easy way, and he ended up dead (over and over again at that)

[gumpzilla]

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I figured the theme was there is no "easy way" in magic. Angier tried to find an easy way, and he ended up dead (over and over again at that)

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So what do you make of Cutter's final line, which I looked up at imdb:

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Now you're looking for the secret... but you won't find it because you're not really looking. You don't really want to know the secret... You want to be fooled.

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Note this is repeated from his monologue at the beginning, here with some context:

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Every great magic trick consists of three parts or acts. The first part is called "The Pledge". The magician shows you something ordinary: a deck of cards, a bird or a man. He shows you this object. Perhaps he asks you to inspect it to see if it is indeed real, unaltered, normal. But of course... it probably isn't. The second act is called "The Turn". The magician takes the ordinary something and makes it do something extraordinary. Now you're looking for the secret... but you won't find it, because of course you're not really looking. You don't really want to know. You want to be fooled.

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[traz]

I figured he was referencing Bale's double life trick

[evil twin]

I'm with gump on this one. We only see the clone Angier with the real Angier for certain once, and that is told by Angier in a diary left for Borden to discover. It's not valid evidence for there really being a clone.

Secondly I think the drunken double Angier uses earlier on in the film has a dimple on his chin which Angier doesn't have. This is a detail I need to check, but if you can see the dimple on the dead Angier "clone" at the end then that further confirms it is us, the audience, who has been tricked.

The movie is excellent, but imagine how good it would be if he had most people who watched it fooled as well. An incredible accoplishment.

[CrazyEyez]

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I'm with gump on this one. We only see the clone Angier with the real Angier for certain once, and that is told by Angier in a diary left for Borden to discover. It's not valid evidence for there really being a clone.

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Incorrect. The diary narration was long over by they time they flashed back to double angiers. It was as Angier was shot and dying. And he never explains it to Borden. It was simply a flashback, which means it's true. In fact during the flashback, and then as Angier dies, Borden still hasn't noticed the clones. Angier says, "You don't know where you are. Look around you." Borden says, "I don't care." Then Angiers dies, Borden walks down the hall, and only then does he turn around and notice the bodies.

Angiers at the end ruminates, "No one cares about the man in the box." He realizes that he still isn't satisfied, because now everyone thinks he's dead. The payoff is when you reappear, which he now cannot do. That's why Cutter says it's all for nothing. And that's why in the penultimate scene, cutter narates, "You wouldn't clap yet. Because making something disappear isn't enough. You have to bring it back." And as he says those words, Borden II walks in, seemingly from the dead, and embraces his daughter. Borden wins, Angiers loses.

The final narration about how you don't really want to know - that just means you don't really want to know that Angiers committed murder/suicide every performance. You would just rather be fooled.

Also, the book is supernatural. Why wouldn't the movie be? The final suprise to the audience is that you think he has some trick, but he actually clones himself. You guys are taking it one level too far.

[gumpzilla]

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The final narration about how you don't really want to know - that just means you don't really want to know that Angiers committed murder/suicide every performance. You would just rather be fooled.

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This makes no sense. Accepting the movie's account of things leads to this scenario, so in what sense are you being fooled?

And you're certain that the first mention of cloning doesn't occur in the journals? I was pretty sure that Angier's journal that Borden reads in prison culminates with him discovering the hats and cats; between that and him being the one to talk about the cloning at the end, there is no point where the cloning is ever mentioned by anybody other than Angier, to my knowledge.

[CrazyEyez]

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The final narration about how you don't really want to know - that just means you don't really want to know that Angiers committed murder/suicide every performance. You would just rather be fooled.

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This makes no sense. Accepting the movie's account of things leads to this scenario, so in what sense are you being fooled?


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I'm not sure what you mean. What I mean is that the last scene of the movie is a room full of dead guys in tanks. That's the secret to the trick. "You don't really want to know the secret, do you?" See what I mean?

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And you're certain that the first mention of cloning doesn't occur in the journals? I was pretty sure that Angier's journal that Borden reads in prison culminates with him discovering the hats and cats; between that and him being the one to talk about the cloning at the end, there is no point where the cloning is ever mentioned by anybody other than Angier, to my knowledge.

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Ah yes, I forgot about the cats and hats. That was in the diary. But the final part where you see Angiers shoot the clone - you keep saying that we don't have to believe it because no one other than Angiers says it. Here's what I'm saying - Angiers never says it. I think you are assuming that the flashback coincides with Angiers explaining it to Borden. It doesn't. Angiers and Borden are talking about other stuff while you see it. The flashback is purely for the viewers. That's why I claim it's fact.

[xxThe_Lebowskixx]

wowwowowowowoow i am searching for my The Prestige DVD and it is missing. that is soooooo weird.

[Cancuk]

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I loved the movie. Thought it was very entertaining with pretty solid twists at the end.

I figured out exactly waht was up with the drowning guys trick right away but was pretty surprised by the other guy having a clone too.

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Brother, not clone.