$16 - KK, surprise card hits - Page 2

eurythmech · #11 11-03-2007, 02:52 PM

Betting also folds draws.
Also, if flop goes check-check, what do we do when villain bets turn?

vers · #12 11-03-2007, 03:22 PM

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I think betting on flop makes sense if he is likely to fold Ace-rag (a better hand).

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No donk in the history of sng's has called pf with ace-rag and then folded on the flop.

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QFT.

I cbet flop 230 or something most of the time.

diditmyway · #13 11-03-2007, 04:02 PM

c/c flop to not lose actions from worse hands.

mattiesmat · #14 11-03-2007, 04:02 PM

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c/c flop to not lose actions from worse hands.

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That makes sense, but what about the hearts.
Giving a free card is a mistake IMO.

aghasax · #15 11-03-2007, 04:41 PM

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Betting also folds draws.
Also, if flop goes check-check, what do we do when villain bets turn?

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that's true, but he will have two harts very seldom. I would call a turn bet, but since turn brought the third heart I might fold

drzen · #16 11-04-2007, 01:57 AM

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Against just one player I'd usually just bet this flop for about 200, an ace is a huge part of our range and a lot of what villain has will probably give up right away.

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You can make an argument for betting the flop, but getting villain to fold worse hands really shouldn't be part of it.

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Chit, there goes my theory of stealing blinds then.

JacJacAtk · #17 11-04-2007, 12:17 PM

You don't technically want your opponents folding worse hands to blind steals either (and, yes, I know that ICM math and game situations can actually change that such that you do want a fold even versus worse hands in plenty of spots).

This spot is not similar to a blind steal, in that you never get a better hand to fold by betting here and on a blind steal it's quite possible to get a better hand (even a much better hand) to fold. Likewise, by betting here you frequently get a worse hand that's way behind to fold correctly, when you might be able to get that hand to bet (or payoff a bet) on a later street.

And, all that said, betting here isn't terrible, because of the draws. It's betting here in order to get your opponent to (correctly) fold hands that are behind that's a bad approach to evaluating the decision.