Putting a Player on a Hand

[KnightEnder]

What do you think is the most important aspect to consider when putting a player on a hand?

Position?
Bet? (Raise, Call, etc.)
Size of bet?
Personality/Style? (If you've played with them long enough)
Tells? (Assuming the above.)
The Board? (Seeing what is out there and what they could be betting on.)
Stack Size? (M)
Something I'm leaving out?

Of course all of the above go into it, but what is the most important? And failing that; what do you look at first? (My guess is position.)

In other words how does Daniel do it, and how do you do it, if you do?

Thanks.

KE <ul type="square">[/list]

[ImprovinNewbie]

all of these things. the book that taught me the most about reading hands (and now, especially against predictable players i can call out there hands) is HOH3. the action in the hand will dictate what they have. a raise preflop means a certain range of hands, for most players. a certain size bet on a certain texture board means certain things. and so on. reading the texture of the board is very important. knowing what flops might have hit your opponent. always knowing what draws are out there and how your man may or may not play their draw. hand reading is rarely about puting someone on one hand, its about putting them on several and playing as appropriatly as possible for all of them. sometimes a villian wil bet small on the river and you will think they have been on a draw the whole time but know they wont bet that certain size without looking for a call, or they will when they miss a draw. if its very small you may have ot call anyway because you are pot commited. conversely you may have to laydown what you are pretty sure is the best hand to a BIG bet when a draw hits even if you are pretty sure you are good, b/c the number of times you arent wont make up for the number of times you are good. a combination of math, logic, and a little bit of instinct will make you a good hand reader.

[paddymcg21]

The way to get information is generally through betting. Obviously this means that if you have a large stack in relation to the blinds then you can invest some chips to find out where you stand. Throw strange size raises out there and see how they react to them. Get inside their head and think of the hands that you would make the play they just made with. e.g. say you both have 10,000 chips with blinds of 300/600, your oponent raises to 1,500 and you with your AK re raise to 3,500 and he flat calls. Now he's either a complete idiot or he has a very big hand. It's the sort of play you'd make with AA or KK thinking you're being very clever disguising your hand, in fact him just calling is letting you know he has a huge hand, whereby if he's moved in you'd be far more confident your AK was good. This is a very basic example but then the answer to your question is very simple. Try all you can to get inside their heads and think of the hands they could have to make certain plays. The fact is sometimes you just won't have a clue what kind of hand your opponent has so unless you have a big hand you are forced to get out of the way.I always try my best to watch every single hand at any table im at and watch exactly what bets people make and hopefully get to see the hands at showdown. The best players remember every hand and use the information when they have a marginal decision to make.

[oakley77]

Style I think is most important, if the person is playin every hand and playing it the same way then you can't put him on a hand.
Most important is to be able to put someone on a certain range of hands and then analyzing which of those hands he could have

[Josem]

This question, while admirable in its ambition, fails to take into account common sense.


These factors are all inter-related. There is no useful answer to the question of what is most important.


For example, a raise in late position indicates a wider range than a raise UTG, typically. Yet, you need to balance that with previous action - if someone has raised UTG, another person has re-raised, and the button has re-re-raised, obviously that has to be a very, very tight range if there are deep stacks. If the stacks are shorter, the re-re-raising range opens up again.

Sometimes the issues are moot because of the board. eg, an extreme example: AKQJ4 board, you have 23, and your opponent pushes on the river. You beat precisely *nothing*, and thus, reading your opponent's hand is irrelevant.

[local_9]

[ QUOTE ]
e.g. say you both have 10,000 chips with blinds of 300/600, your oponent raises to 1,500 and you with your AK re raise to 3,500 and he flat calls. Now he's either a complete idiot or he has a very big hand. It's the sort of play you'd make with AA or KK thinking you're being very clever disguising your hand, in fact him just calling is letting you know he has a huge hand, whereby if he's moved in you'd be far more confident your AK was good.

[/ QUOTE ]

I enjoyed your post although do not completely agree with your example. The Flat call from your opponent in the example does not mean he is a complete idiot or on AA/KK(possible hands, but not the only hands). I would consider other playable hands based on the players position and style, along with what you offered with your re-raise. In your example you are giving almost 3 to 1 pot odds for your opponent to call, so calling with a lesser hand and not AA/KK is a possible move.

This is an interesting thread and all the points are valid; Josem might have summed it up best with ‘Inter-related’. You put players on a range of hands based off all the information you have gathered, there is no best or most important piece – the players position, betting, style and another good indicator number of hands played – all together will help you assess the range of hands an opponent may be playing. Thanks, matt

[KnightEnder]

Thanks for y'alls input. I really appreciate it.

And I will donate a portion of my winnings to y'all every time I use your advice. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

KE

[LouisCyphre]

If there is any one piece of information that could be considered the most important one then that has to be the last action your opponent has taken.

[Rocklegend]

My 2 cents...

Top players know that you are probably trying to read them and they play you rather than their cards. Don't fall into this trap. You CAN get a good read on a weak player...forget about getting a read on a good player. If you do get a good read on a player, do the opposite of what you were going to do as it is very likely that they were deceiving you. Play the player, not your cards.

The Legend