possible reason arod signed early?

[CharlieDontSurf]

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IMO, if the 10/275 deal goes through, it will be a good development for NY, better than him going to another team. Obviously him not opting out would have been preferable, but altogether I am happy with how it worked out. I find it a little hard to believe all the crap about how Arod was "beside himself" when he realized he might have to leave New York and then went back to the table without Boras, but whatever. I had originally been convinced he really did want to stay in NY and wouldn't opt out, and then when he did opt out (after obviously knowing he was going to opt out for a long time), I thought it was clear he was done with being treated like [censored] in NY and getting booed while putting up MVP seasons, but perhaps not. Who knows anymore.

If you think 10/275 is overpaying, you are greatly underestimating both how much Arod increases the yankees' chance of making the playoffs for the next couple years, and how much money the yankees have to spend. They have so much to lose by not having him on the team for the next couple seasons, and there aren't that many places where the Yankees can spend their money productively.

If what ended up happening was that Boras looked at the extension and said "Arod, you are worth much more than this, the Yankees are bluffing" and knew all along something like this was develop, he obviously played it brilliantly. People want to hate Boras and want it to be reprehensible for Arod to opt out and squeeze every last dollar out of NY, so they call it bad agenting because they think its greedy. Although the timing of the announcement was really, really stupid.

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owseley..u seem to be looking past the fact that it was a 10 day window to negotiate once the WS ends. The Yankees were preparing to make their 1st offer during Game 4.

They key word is 1ST OFFER. It wasn't a take this offer or hit the road stance.

Boras was so confident that teams would be going nuts over Arod that he said " u can get more on the market Alex and the Yankees are just BSing, the day after we opt out they will be offering us bigger and bigger contracts and other teams will be bidding so it will make the size of the contract skyrocket...I'm so sure that there will be a bidding frenzy that I'm not going to even bother trying to milk the Yankees and see how high they will go before the opt out date."

[Vyse]

Dude, wasn't it like one day where you could even talk money with A-Rod? Why in the world are you assuming A-Rod had no interest?

Like seriously, look at what you're saying:

Yanks say A-Rod won't opt out or they will not re-sign him or negotiate
A-Rod opts out, pissing off the Yanks
A-Rod finds no one wants his services
A-Rod runs back to Yanks
Yanks gladly give A-Rod a monstrous 10-year contract when no other team was bidding?

The Yankees made a HUGE stink about the money from the Rangers. Eight years $225 million was the number tossed out before. So the Yankees decided they suddenly not only don't even care about the Ranger money lost, but they'll tack on two extra years and $50 million with possibly $25 million or more in incentives just because? Out of the kindness of their heart?

Get a clue.

[Zutroy]

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Why wouldn't he? Boras gets a cut. Wow, seriously.

Zutroy, Charlie isn't even bothering to directly respond to your point because he knows how asinine it is.

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Yeah, I don't know. I though this was pretty straightforward stuff.

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lol

Zutroy doesn't believe that the Yankees would have offered 10 years and 275 or even anything above that unless he opts out and is a free agent.

Yet when Alex is a free agent...virtually no one is making the kind of offers the Yankees are able to make. Alex has to come back to the Yankees and do negotiations on their terms..and they throw up 10 years 275 as essentially the offer they are fine with giving.

What exactly did opting out do to drive up the price?
Was it the fact that the Yankees saw that no one else was going to pay more than 8 years 225? Was it the fact that Boras was removed from negotiations?

Tell me what exactly enabled Arod to get a better deal than what he could have gotten if he had bothered to negotiate pre-opt out.

Posada got a amazing deal that in most people's eyes was to much for that old of a catcher, same with Rivera...why did they get these huge deals? Cuz the [censored] Yankees didn't want them to hit the open market. Could they have gotten a better deal by becoming free agents..possibly...but they could have also gotten a worse.

If Boras negotiates non stop with the Yankees there is no way he doesn't get 10 years 275 min. The Yankees were hapy to give that to Arod last week...they would be happy with that deal pre-opt out.He most likely gets more. Why?
Because the Yankees have said we're not negotiating if u opt out so basically they said to everyone "we have to sign u in these next 10 days or we lose you for good".

If they are on the 9th day with one left to go and the Yankees offer the same offer they gave Arod last week when he has NO leverage(275/10)...and Boras comes back with 10 years but 30 million per year and revenue.You think the Yankees are going to be "OMG an extra 30 million? No way thats craazy...we'll sign Mike Lowell to 4 years instead."

The Yankees never made an official offer. Boras essentially said [censored] you and [censored] your offers we're opting out cuz we can get the best deal on the open market. He didn't even try t see if he could get a huge deal pre-opt out.

Thats the amazing thing...Boras didn't try to milk the Yankees and see how high they would go before the opt out date. Negotiating wise that is where he screwed up...not to mention making his client look like a douche.

Arod still got a great deal but Boras mishandled the whole thing. He did not do a great job because Arod got a huge contract from the Yankees...Arod would have gotten a huge contract from the Yankees regardless.

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How do you know that the Yankees' starting offer was 10yr/275mill before he opted out? Link? I haven't read anything to that effect and the Yankees' would have been bat-[censored] insane to offer such a contract if the market was as cold as you seem to believe. Their starting offer was likely something much lower or for not nearly as many years, causing Boras and A-Rod to opt out. Once he opted out, Boras received the 8/225 offer. The Yankees responded with this new one. Correct me if any part of this is not factually correct because I'm having a hard time finding a solid timeline on the internets. Btw, which deal is better for A-Rod and which is better for the Yankees in your opinion, 5/150 or 10/275?

Also, about the Posada/Rivera deals. Yes the Yankees overpay for certain players but neither of those deals is nearly as large as this one. It's not even close. Just because they are willing to overspend on smaller deals doesn't mean they are willing to do so on the much larger ones. A terrible analogy would be overpaying for groceries and booze and the like but then negotiating for much larger items, like a car or a house.

Edited to add a quick reminder: A-ROD IS THRITY-TWO YEARS OLD AND HE JUST SINGED THE LONGEST AND LARGEST CONTRACT IN MLB HISTORY. HOW DID BORAS FAIL???? DO YOU REALLY THINK THE YANKEES STARTED AT OR WERE WILLING TO GO TO TEN YEARS BEFORE HE OPTED OUT?

[CharlieDontSurf]

They're 1st offer was along the lines of 8 years at nearly 30 million per. IT WAS THEIR FIRST [censored] OFFER!

that means there will be a 2nd, n probably a 3rd etc etc etc.

They had 10 days left to go to agree on a contract. Your telling me the Yankees were only going to make 1 offer then stop negotiating for the next 10 days? They did the exact same thing with Mo and Posada. They gave a initial offer prior to other teams being able to negotiate with the two players.

Mo and Posada said I want more years and more $$$. they made another offer. Mo and Posada said more! And they gave in and gave them more.


We don't even know if Boras actually recieved a 8 year/225 offer that was just a rumor...thats the crazy thing.
The Yankees were idiots and didn't use their leverage to force Arod to choose a worse deal post opt out. This isn't genius by Boras(he didn't for see Arod having to go thru Warren Buffett to get the Yankees to negotiate and then have the Yankees offer a idiotic deal when no one else was even close in contract terms)...its stupidity by the Yankees for not being smart with their money and just throwing it around like its nothing.

[Exitonly]

wasnt the 8yr 225 an extension to his 2 years remaining @ 25per?

[CharlieDontSurf]

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Why wouldn't he? Boras gets a cut. Wow, seriously.

Zutroy, Charlie isn't even bothering to directly respond to your point because he knows how asinine it is.

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Yeah, I don't know. I though this was pretty straightforward stuff.

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lol

Zutroy doesn't believe that the Yankees would have offered 10 years and 275 or even anything above that unless he opts out and is a free agent.

Yet when Alex is a free agent...virtually no one is making the kind of offers the Yankees are able to make. Alex has to come back to the Yankees and do negotiations on their terms..and they throw up 10 years 275 as essentially the offer they are fine with giving.

What exactly did opting out do to drive up the price?
Was it the fact that the Yankees saw that no one else was going to pay more than 8 years 225? Was it the fact that Boras was removed from negotiations?

Tell me what exactly enabled Arod to get a better deal than what he could have gotten if he had bothered to negotiate pre-opt out.

Posada got a amazing deal that in most people's eyes was to much for that old of a catcher, same with Rivera...why did they get these huge deals? Cuz the [censored] Yankees didn't want them to hit the open market. Could they have gotten a better deal by becoming free agents..possibly...but they could have also gotten a worse.

If Boras negotiates non stop with the Yankees there is no way he doesn't get 10 years 275 min. The Yankees were hapy to give that to Arod last week...they would be happy with that deal pre-opt out.He most likely gets more. Why?
Because the Yankees have said we're not negotiating if u opt out so basically they said to everyone "we have to sign u in these next 10 days or we lose you for good".

If they are on the 9th day with one left to go and the Yankees offer the same offer they gave Arod last week when he has NO leverage(275/10)...and Boras comes back with 10 years but 30 million per year and revenue.You think the Yankees are going to be "OMG an extra 30 million? No way thats craazy...we'll sign Mike Lowell to 4 years instead."

The Yankees never made an official offer. Boras essentially said [censored] you and [censored] your offers we're opting out cuz we can get the best deal on the open market. He didn't even try t see if he could get a huge deal pre-opt out.

Thats the amazing thing...Boras didn't try to milk the Yankees and see how high they would go before the opt out date. Negotiating wise that is where he screwed up...not to mention making his client look like a douche.

Arod still got a great deal but Boras mishandled the whole thing. He did not do a great job because Arod got a huge contract from the Yankees...Arod would have gotten a huge contract from the Yankees regardless.

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How do you know that the Yankees' starting offer was 10yr/275mill before he opted out? Link? I haven't read anything to that effect and the Yankees' would have been bat-[censored] insane to offer such a contract if the market was as cold as you seem to believe. Their starting offer was likely something much lower or for not nearly as many years, causing Boras and A-Rod to opt out. Once he opted out, Boras received the 8/225 offer. The Yankees responded with this new one. Correct me if any part of this is not factually correct because I'm having a hard time finding a solid timeline on the internets. Btw, which deal is better for A-Rod and which is better for the Yankees in your opinion, 5/150 or 10/275?

Also, about the Posada/Rivera deals. Yes the Yankees overpay for certain players but neither of those deals is nearly as large as this one. It's not even close. Just because they are willing to overspend on smaller deals doesn't mean they are willing to do so on the much larger ones. A terrible analogy would be overpaying for groceries and booze and the like but then negotiating for much larger items, like a car or a house.

Edited to add a quick reminder: A-ROD IS THRITY-TWO YEARS OLD AND HE JUST SINGED THE LONGEST AND LARGEST CONTRACT IN MLB HISTORY. HOW DID BORAS FAIL???? DO YOU REALLY THINK THE YANKEES STARTED AT OR WERE WILLING TO GO TO TEN YEARS BEFORE HE OPTED OUT?

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He didn't fail. but he did a poor job as an agent at trying to get his client the best deal humanly possible while still maintaining a positive image for his client


and yes the Yankees would have gone to 10 years pre-opt out.
Their 1st offer was 8 years.
Your honestly telling me that if arod says I walk unless u go to 10 the Yanks are going to say...ok we'll go with W. Betemit.

Arod would possibly be chasing the HR record in those last two years( that would be huge amount sof $$ for the Yankees that would easily off set overpaying for an old player) if he isn't chasing that record...THEY'RE THE [censored] YANKEES. The can afford to over pay at the end of the contract in order to keep a player.

[Thremp]

CDS,

You are a fool.

[Zutroy]

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wasnt the 8yr 225 an extension to his 2 years remaining @ 25per?

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No, I think they offered him a 5yr/150mill extension to the 3/81 he already had. This would have been about 8/231, altogether (Link).

Charile,
I see your point after doing a bit of digging but I still disagree. A-Rod got two more years added to an already monstrous offer. I don't think he could have gotten more if he just asked for it. They didn't offer him 10yrs, they offered him 8. If he had continued negotiating, the best possible outcome would be a deal like the one they just offered him. The Posada/Rivera deals aren't nearly as large or potentially crippling as A-Rod's. The Yankees do indeed have money to spend but why do you believe they would be so careless with it? I think we also disagree on our opinions of Cashman: I think he is good at his job while you think he is a retard.

[CharlieDontSurf]

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Dude, wasn't it like one day where you could even talk money with A-Rod? Why in the world are you assuming A-Rod had no interest?

Like seriously, look at what you're saying:

Yanks say A-Rod won't opt out or they will not re-sign him or negotiate
A-Rod opts out, pissing off the Yanks
A-Rod finds no one wants his services
A-Rod runs back to Yanks
Yanks gladly give A-Rod a monstrous 10-year contract when no other team was bidding?

The Yankees made a HUGE stink about the money from the Rangers. Eight years $225 million was the number tossed out before. So the Yankees decided they suddenly not only don't even care about the Ranger money lost, but they'll tack on two extra years and $50 million with possibly $25 million or more in incentives just because? Out of the kindness of their heart?

Get a clue.

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UH YES.

do u really think the yankees gave a [censored] about 21 million in the grand scheme of things? Sure they would have prefered to keep it does it really hurt the Yankees that badly?

That was a ploy to try to stop Boras from opting out. The Yankees were worried that once Arod was on the open market and lots of other teams were throwing contracts at him things would get nuts.(this never happened)

I have no idea why the Yankees agreed to offer Arod 10/275 given the environment at the time. There was no reason to because no one else was going to get close to it. They knew this last week. But they didn't know this a month ago when Arod had 10 days left before he could opt out.


That is the difference between the two situations.
The fact the Yanks gave Arod 10/275 despite them not needing to given the cold market supports my argument that they could have possibly gotten an even better deal pre-opt out.

If the Yankees were totally willing to give Arod 10/275 when they could see that the market was pretty cold then Arod could have gotten that or better pre-opt out when it was assumed that many teams would be in play for Arod and the Yankees had a extra 21 million to add to the contract.

[CharlieDontSurf]

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wasnt the 8yr 225 an extension to his 2 years remaining @ 25per?

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No, I think they offered him a 5yr/150mill extension to the 3/81 he already had. This would have been about 8/231, altogether (Link).

Charile,
I see your point after doing a bit of digging but I still disagree. A-Rod got two more years added to an already monstrous offer. I don't think he could have gotten more if he just asked for it. They didn't offer him 10yrs, they offered him 8. If he had continued negotiating, the best possible outcome would be a deal like the one they just offered him. The Posada/Rivera deals aren't nearly as large or potentially crippling as A-Rod's. The Yankees do indeed have money to spend but why do you believe they would be so careless with it? I think we also disagree on our opinions of Cashman: I think he is good at his job while you think he is a retard.

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JESUS CHRIST lol

Zutroy not trying to be a dick but this is basic negotiating.
You don't give you best offer when you make your initial offer. You give a lowball offer and then the other party makes a counter offer and then you make a 2nd offer and then the other party makes a counter offer. repeat and rinse repreat and rinse.

This is exactly what happened with Posada and Rivera. Same thing would have happened with Arod pre-opt out. The Yankees do this with every FA. They don't make their 1st offer the best offer they are willing to offer.

This is why people hire a agent like Boras...to force a team to keep upping an offer to the highest they are willing to go.