expert

[Buffsta8]

if 5 betting isnt allowed on your site fold pre flop

[DrewOnTilt]

[ QUOTE ]
If by expert you mean retarded then yes your river play is expert. When people check/raise the river on a blank flush card it usually means a flush. This is true whether its a backdoor flush or conventional flush. So all you have on the river is a crying call. Make that call and be happy if you win.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's exactly what he did. Read his 2nd post in this thread, response to Death Donkey. I had to read this thread twice to catch that, too.

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
yeah that's what i did. i went for the lolo trick you and post 1 wins. I was expecting several "i don't fold" posts followed by miles' "you didn't fold this"

gg dd

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I shouldve figured that. Theres only two 2+2ers that I know of who are capable of 3bet/folding the river here: JasonT, who I havent seen on here in months, and Kwaz.

[danzasmack]

i think in this spot 3-betting is just bad though.

I think also that 3-bet fold to a cap is a bad play in the games I play. I can find enough spots in my DB where calling the 4-bet is winning in longterm.

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
yeah that's what i did. i went for the lolo trick you and post 1 wins. I was expecting several "i don't fold" posts followed by miles' "you didn't fold this"

gg dd

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I shouldve figured that. Theres only two 2+2ers that I know of who are capable of 3bet/folding the river here: JasonT, who I havent seen on here in months, and Kwaz.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jason doesn't play poker anymore. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Believe it or not I'm capable of 3-bet/folding the river too, but it's such a rare situation that I'm not offended that you didn't mention me. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Rob

[HighStakesPro]

There are two reasons to three-bet the river. One is, you suspect someone is raise bluffing the river but you have an even weaker hand. The other is when you have a strong made hand and are reraising for value. In this case, a three-bet/fold to cap on the river can only be correct in very specific, rare circumstances.

1. You must be absolutely sure that you will never be capped by a worse made hand or a bluff (or at least, sure enough to easily justify declining the huge pot odds you will be getting).

2. You must be sure that you will get called by a worse hand significantly more than you will get called OR raised by a better hand. It does not matter how often your opponent folds a worse hand.

Both 1 and 2 must be true in order to justify a three-bet/fold on the river, and even if they are,the amount of EV you gain is so negligible (maybe 0.5 big bets) that it's not really worth it because there's too good a chance that you will be wrong about 1 or 2 and could lose a lot of money.

[johnnyrocket]

yea, i seriously never think death donkey misplays a hand, every time i read a post and think about the perfect play donkey has already posted it. i will beat him to it one of these days

[skilled]

[ QUOTE ]
Do any of you actually count how often your "crying calls" win? It's not hard - bit of paper and a pen, and tick marks. Count them. I recommend keeping track similarly of your bluffs.

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Regarding keeping track of how often your crying calls work and bluffs... I fail to see how this is helpful unless you also keep track of the pot-size while making your crying calls and bluffs... Otherwise, there is no measure as to whether you are calling too often or bluffing too often no?

[YertleTurtle]

Clearly if villian is bluff-raising the river the 3-bet fold line has no extra value. As for crying calls, I see plenty of desperation bluffs and players that second best hands that they are convinced are best. I just don't see value in this line - in fact you lost an extra bet with a slim chance (lets say 5%) that you folded the best hand.

YT

[cdlarmore]

[ QUOTE ]
If by expert you mean retarded then yes your river play is expert. When people check/raise the river on a blank flush card it usually means a flush. This is true whether its a backdoor flush or conventional flush. So all you have on the river is a crying call. Make that call and be happy if you win.

[/ QUOTE ]