Neverwin on 100/200 6-max early this morning (Feb 15)

[climber]

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No, I totally agree with you. I think that the majority of the stuff I read here is written by mimics with no conceptual understanding of how the game actually works or how they should improve.

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Nice

[kiddo]

Good post, u are good at discussing poker and thats what I here at 2+2 to do. There are some guys that really dont want to learn how to think about poker, they just want to know how the best player plays and they they will try to play like that, hoping they also become rich.

[tolbiny]

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In a few years all the good players will be at 100/100 and making boatloads of cash.

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Dane- Its so obvious that you can't ever have a 100/100 style of play as long as there is a cap on the # of bets- you will eventually just have to call 4 cold- also every now and then your LRR with AA will miss- you'll end up with 100/99 style.

[tolbiny]

Wynton touched on this- and in all the semi screwing around that is going on here it hasn't been expanded on- that is your optimal play depends on your opponents. a 22/17 style was great for the games a couple of years ago, but as more and more 22/16 guys filetered in and started MTing you had a subtle effect. Those of us who are pussies (like me) would just avoid other good players- three bet them with the goods and otherwise concerntrate on the fish- but the really good players, the smart Nate tha great types decided to attack us as well, and take our money. Hitting our blinds when we were out of position, c/r us liberally when we attacked their blinds, adding points to their VPIP and PFR while we were just guessing what they had. And when we saw what was happening we parroted them again and became 25/18 guys- meanwhile they became the 30/20 who terrorized us still (at least those who didn't move up and start killing the 30/60 games and up). And now as we try to parrot them again there are those experimenting with the 35/25 style.
Meanwhile the Loosest and most passive players bust the fastest (except for you, bobvu) while the LAGs have a much better chance of hanging around so the pool of players has gotten more aggro as a whole, so now we see psyco 50/40 guys at the table all the time. Whats the best way to beat guys like that for your average player? something like 27/19 would be my guess. Go back to pounding them with superior starting hands and position. The best players here will still be able to get away with the 30/20 andhigher styles, but those of us who fail to handread, and fail to think beyond PT stats will just have to fall back onto the S&M basics of hand and seat selection.
Its not such a bad life.

[shaddix]

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go back and read old posts. i think that thread is linked in this thread. ppl advocated 20/15. now the best play 35/25. thats a 15% vpip. you tried to minimilize it by saying 5% but that isnt gonna work.

i have read 2p2 for awhile. ill let you in a little secret: first let me qualify: dont read this if you are weak at heart, scare easily or are overly worrisome. you may not be able sleep for a couple days either.

ok, here it is: 2p2 is not always right.

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please help me. I'll give you half my winnings for the next 6 months

[Grue]

I think this is all a bunch of ridiculous semi mysticism and people who believe this crap should be ashamed. put the average drossian (.5 bb/100 @ 15/30) at a 6m table full of 50/40s or even 40/30s and he will demolish them. The very nature of limit holdem is that "great" postflop play cannot overcome terrible preflop play and anyone who has played for a long time should agree with that. This is especially true since in my opinion in the last 6 mo-1 year WTSD #s have increased dramatically.

[helpmeout]

I agree the games have become tighter so a more aggressive style is appropriate.

Back in the days the games would have much more open limping, you cant get 60/1 guys to fold their bottom pair. You beat them by playing better hands.

Now the games are full of more tight players so by playing more LAG you pickup more blind money.

A lot of tight players and loose ones suck postflop, they still make a lot of bad decisions whether it be folding too easily or making bad calldowns there is still money to be made from these players.

Me I'm just too lazy to make an effort trying to exploit every possible weakness.

Every style is exploitable though, there is no best style, just better players.

[Wynton]

Thanks for noticing, Tolbiny. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

One reason I've been thinking about different styles is that I've recently spent time at a couple of sites playing as low as 1/2. (No, the downswing isn't that bad, I just have small rolls at a couple of places and wanted to try building it slowly). As you might expect, the real low levels are full of ultra-passives, who are impossible to bluff. You simply need to show the best hands. Against those types, I think a 40/30 player would do VERY badly, because people always go to showdown.

And what I wonder is whether the 40/30 (or 35/25 or even 30/20) player will eventually do badly at the very high, presumably very LAGy climate also. For based on reports of other people, it sounds like those games also require you to go to showdown much of the time, since no one really gives much credit to their opponents' aggression. Maybe those games haven't hit that point yet, but if they keep getting looser and looser, I would think that tighter play will make more sense.

Am I guessing wrong that the 35/25 style seems particularly well-suited to beating the low-mid level games (i.e., 3/6-10/20), but not the micro-levels (below 3/6) and not the upper level, or at least highly LAGy games?

[einbert]

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limit holdem is all luck. its a total sham really. i anticipate most everyone on this site will be broke in a few years. variance will break everyone.

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