Coaching WARNING - Page 9

pokersanjuan · #81 03-07-2007, 03:31 PM

Hey thanks for posting your experience with snowbank also Shultz.

To all the questions asking about how snowbank did his coaching, schultz has the direct transcript - he is never available, and the coaching sucked. I am not the only one, who feels like this about snowbank.

Again I am not blaming him for my losses, but do not feel I should have to pay the remainder of lessons I am not using.

El Diablo · #82 03-07-2007, 03:34 PM

All,

I wrote this in the other thread:

"OP,

I think you were pretty naive in your expectations and actions here and as people have said, you aren't OWED anything, but from reading the chat it sure seems to me like the right thing for snowbank to do is to refund your money (or maybe keep $150 for one extra hour as a compromise?). Not doing that seems just like a dick move to me."

Reading above, seems like snowbank has a clear option here. Charge $200/hr for the two hours, refund $350.

I also am realizing that I am probably owed about six million dollars in coaching fees from 2+2 kids I've helped on AIM haha.

KRANTZ · #83 03-07-2007, 03:35 PM

i pretty much agree with everything taylor had to say, and a lot of what TWP said.

some scattered thoughts on all this

on snowbank:
1-he is definitely a big winning player at 1/2NL
2-i think it's crazy that he would charge so much, and in advance, without an established coaching reputation or track record (and coupled with the fact that there are people who play MSNL and HSNL regularly who don't even charge that much). just being a winner is NOT a prerequisite to being a capable coach.
3-snowbank SHOULD give the money back for the unusued lessons, but that's essentially an ethical issue. the "opportunity cost" of coaching others argument is really weak, especially considering those of us that choose to coach give up a lot of money in the first place by coaching over playing. so to be nitty about sacrificing other students is ridiculous; you should be playing instead if the value of your time means that much.

on OP
1-do some research before you get a coach.
2-don't pay in advance unless you trust the coach to refund money for unused lessons if you decide they're not what you're looking for.
3- if a coach only bills in advance (which like others have pointed out, is sometimes the most convenient thing for both parties), it's still not unreasonable for the student to do one lesson first, evaluate the coaching, and then decide whether or not they want to purchase a package of lessons.
4- it is in NO WAY snowbank's fault that you lost money playing. that's your own fault. and it's incredibly immature of you to blame this on him. a coach teaches you. he does NOT click buttons for you. honestly, a lot of your OP makes you sound like you're in eighth grade.

TheWorstPlayer · #84 03-07-2007, 03:35 PM

PM me your aim, please? Haha...

Piece of Cake · #85 03-07-2007, 03:36 PM

Reply to surf. I was defending why coaches sell these sessions in bulk not snowbank in particular. It appears there's a lot more going on with this incident. I really should refrain from posting in nonstrat threads.

Dire · #86 03-07-2007, 03:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
some scattered thoughts on all this

on snowbank:
1-he is definitely a big winning player at 1/2NL

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would a 'big winning player' who seems to have zero interest in coaching offer lessons at a rate less than his opportunity cost?

tufat23 · #87 03-07-2007, 03:51 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
some scattered thoughts on all this

on snowbank:
1-he is definitely a big winning player at 1/2NL

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would a 'big winning player' who seems to have zero interest in coaching offer lessons at a rate less than his opportunity cost?

[/ QUOTE ]

he'll be offering at around 1/2 his hrly rate. variance free money is nice sometimes

pokersanjuan · #88 03-07-2007, 04:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]

4- it is in NO WAY snowbank's fault that you lost money playing. that's your own fault. and it's incredibly immature of you to blame this on him. a coach teaches you. he does NOT click buttons for you. honestly, a lot of your OP makes you sound like you're in eighth grade.

[/ QUOTE ]

thanks for your reply. I am not blaming him for my losses. I just would like a refund for unused sessions. The first I ever heard of no refunds was THIS chat.

Also as stated, The sessions we did have were not good. I posted this a few times, and another student of his posted in this thread (with chat transcripts) how much he sucked also.

tufat23 · #89 03-07-2007, 04:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

4- it is in NO WAY snowbank's fault that you lost money playing. that's your own fault. and it's incredibly immature of you to blame this on him. a coach teaches you. he does NOT click buttons for you. honestly, a lot of your OP makes you sound like you're in eighth grade.

[/ QUOTE ]

thanks for your reply. I am not blaming him for my losses. I just would like a refund for unused sessions. The first I ever heard of no refunds was THIS chat.

Also as stated, The sessions we did have were not good. I posted this a few times, and another student of his posted in this thread (with chat transcripts) how much he sucked also.

[/ QUOTE ]

if snowbank is willing to transfer them, i'll buy the 3 remaining lessons off u for $225

nation · #90 03-07-2007, 04:17 PM

agree with el diablo and krantz here...right thing to do is give the money back obviously.

you just cost yourself students, although based on wrshultz's trip report, maybe you shouldn't be coaching anyways if thats how you conduct business. coaches should always be available via aim and should definitely be more prepared for lessons. $150/hour is a lot of money, they deserve more than the service you gave them.