Cheating in Online Poker

[NHFunkii]

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[for the record, the only multiaccounting name I know about and have proof of right now is...JJProdigy. lols.]

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wait, does that mean he's been multiaccounting since he got banned? cause obviously you know about zeejustin, so I'm guessing yes. If so, good lord what an idiot.

[uclabruinz]

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I really don't think that ZJ signing that deal with bodog should ahve pissed you off as much (or at all) liek it seems to have done.

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Statements like this, with nothing further, drive me batty. Please explain why you think it is no big deal that a big-name poker site has signed the most famous known cheater in all of online poker?

[DVaut1]

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I am asking (again) for specifics about the extent of the problem. What specifically did you learn in Vegas? Some here are saying it's not a big deal, some like you are saying it's huge. Whether or not it is a big deal greatly effects whether I write an article, get further involved, etc.

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I can understand adanthar not wanting to engage in speculation and hearsay, though, either -- so I can see why he wouldn't want to broadcast the "specifics" of what he learned because they're likely second and third-hand rumors. Isn't that essentially what's at the center of the problem -- namely that the cheating is probably rampant but no one quite has any conclusive evidence to do any kind of meaningful finger pointing?

This is sort of why I both agree and disagree with you, ucla -- the sites are the only parties who can likely produce meaningful evidence of multi-account cheating, so much of the pressure should be applied to them (that's where I agree with you); I question, though, how much the 'community' can do without causing unnecessary fear and engaging in baseless allegations and glorified witch hunts. I'm not claiming you're going to start a witch hunt or engage in baseless allegations, BUT I think there's a decent chance a published article could cause unnecessary fear in an industry where there's already alot of unnecessary mistrust (I'm thinking of rumors of doomswitches, 'action' flops, etc. here).

But IF the problem is of a huge magnitude, then perhaps the resultant fear and distrust isn't quite so unnecessary. Again, I feel like I've seen some contradictions as to exactly what the scope of this problem is.

[Exitonly]

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[for the record, the only multiaccounting name I know about and have proof of right now is...JJProdigy. lols.]

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wait, does that mean he's been multiaccounting since he got banned? cause obviously you know about zeejustin, so I'm guessing yes. If so, good lord what an idiot.

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a rumor i've heard more than once... (but could just be a rumor i suppose)

since having JJprodigy removed from the P5's rankings, JJ has had two names ranked simultaneuously.

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and ucla,

i think justin is a former cheater. he cheated, for a short time in his poker career, i dont htink he should avoid signing any sponsorship deals because he had some ethical mishpas when he was 18. And i'm not saying it's great for poker that they did it, but they are far from endorsing cheating by signing Justin.

[adanthar]

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I am asking (again) for specifics about the extent of the problem. What specifically did you learn in Vegas? Some here are saying it's not a big deal, some like you are saying it's huge. Whether or not it is a big deal greatly effects whether I write an article, get further involved, etc.

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I don't have any numbers to give you, except to say that when a bunch of well connected people point at a big MTT leaderboard and say 'that's a shared account and I don't know who's playing it right now, this is JJProdigy and [people X, Y and Z you've heard of] are still multiaccounting and I'm getting pissed' it's really freaking ridiculous.

[uclabruinz]

Adanthar, did you report all those names to the site in question?

[adanthar]

report what, "I heard these guys were cheating, investigate them"? the only hard evidence I ha(d) on anyone is JJ, ("had" because I went to bed a few hours later and woke up not remembering the account name at all) and the guy that told me asked me not to tell as a condition of telling me the account name to begin with. blah. I'll probably report it anyway if I see the name again, but what am I supposed to do, start a crusade with thirdhand info and no proof?

[uclabruinz]

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report what, "I heard these guys were cheating, investigate them"? the only hard evidence I ha(d) on anyone is JJ, ("had" because I went to bed a few hours later and woke up not remembering the account name at all) and the guy that told me asked me not to tell as a condition of telling me the account name to begin with. blah. I'll probably report it anyway if I see the name again, but what am I supposed to do, start a crusade with thirdhand info and no proof?

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If it were me, I would send an email to Stars but make sure that what I had heard was third-hand. They will look at the histories of the account, run their traces or whatever they are, and come to their own conclusions. They aren't going to kick players off the site because Adanthar said he heard a third-hand rumor.

This is exactly why I think the internal policing idea isn't working. Your friend sounds like he was pretty sure of himself and was pissed off. WHY IS HE NOT DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT? How can you, Adanthar, tell me that much of the leaderboard is filled with cheaters, and then tell me to keep my mouth shut about it? You don't think the general public has a right to know about this?

[Caldarooni]

C'mon. Start a crusade is your only option?

[adanthar]

my friend was actionjeff, who started a large thread about it the next day and said he would start exposing people unless they stopped?

(he isn't the guy who knows the JJ-names - that is someone else, who should probably speak up right about now.)

oh, and I don't mean an actual leaderboard - just a big Sunday tourney I happened to be looking at.