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#71
10-09-2007, 12:09 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] ...but I am still 100% happy that c/r is > than c/c. [/ QUOTE ] c/r flop = 1 BB bet turn & river = 2 BB looking at villains aces ont the river = -3BB listen to others = priceless (or at least 1 SB cheaper [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] Yes lets be totally results orientated with the correct line. In which case a fold on the flop was clearly best. 
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#72
10-09-2007, 12:12 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
Yes lets be totally results orientated with the correct line. In which case a fold on the flop was clearly best. [/ QUOTE ] Wrong again, a fold preflop would be best if we knew what villain had.
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#73
10-09-2007, 12:13 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
holy nitpicking
a) he can have 87, hell I could have 87 here b) that isn't the damn point, the point is you can't c/c, c/c, c/f in the hand in the OP because there are too many hands in his range that can't win at showdown and will bluff. if that isn't true c/c c/c c/f is clearly the best line. we all know it isn't. take some time to try to understand the point of what I was making, it will do you a lot more good than whatever you're doing
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#74
10-09-2007, 12:17 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
holy nitpicking a) he can have 87, hell I could have 87 here b) that isn't the damn point, the point is you can't c/c, c/c, c/f in the hand in the OP because there are too many hands in his range that can't win at showdown and will bluff. if that isn't true c/c c/c c/f is clearly the best line. we all know it isn't. take some time to try to understand the point of what I was making, it will do you a lot more good than whatever you're doing [/ QUOTE ] I don't care what you could have, I'm trying to put villain on a reasonable range in order to make a good analysis of this hand. What line do you suggest in the hand jba? I agree that c/f river often is bad since he'll quite often fire the last barrell if thats his only chance to win the hand.
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#75
10-09-2007, 12:18 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
The flop decision here seems close to me, but it should be noted that the higher you move up in limits, the more frequently c/r becomes significantly better than c/c.
In general, against opponents who are somewhat observant, it's pretty important to take an aggressive line with your marginal hands in these kind of spots. The keys here are that you are out of position and your decisions are not very easy when you turn passive. (Contrast that with holding something like KT on a K66 2flushed flop and facing a check/raise while being in position -- putting in further aggressive action is a clear spew.)
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#76
10-09-2007, 12:22 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
With all ego aside this is very much a "depends" hand. Some villains have to be c/c, c/c, flop and turn with the river being again villain dependant with b/f, c/f or c/c all reasonable. Everything being equal, and against the risk of him taking a free card and us being OOP I prefer to take the lead. This can actually save you a SB if you were bound for showdown as he may well raise the turn and we will make a comfortable fold.
Both c/r and c/c on the flop are reasonable though.
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#77
10-09-2007, 12:22 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
it should be noted that the higher you move up in limits, the more frequently c/r becomes significantly better than c/c. [/ QUOTE ] Why is that? And what limits are you talking about? [ QUOTE ] In general, against opponents who are somewhat observant, it's pretty important to take an aggressive line with your marginal hands in these kind of spots. [/ QUOTE ] Why? [ QUOTE ] The keys here are that you are out of position and your decisions are not very easy when you turn passive. [/ QUOTE ] Why? I can't see how things get easier if we get agressive?
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#78
10-09-2007, 12:23 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Yes lets be totally results orientated with the correct line. In which case a fold on the flop was clearly best. [/ QUOTE ] Wrong again, a fold preflop would be best if we knew what villain had. [/ QUOTE ] I'll give you that one. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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#79
10-09-2007, 12:27 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Yes lets be totally results orientated with the correct line. In which case a fold on the flop was clearly best. [/ QUOTE ] Wrong again, a fold preflop would be best if we knew what villain had. [/ QUOTE ] I'll give you that one. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] thanx and I also take credit for changing your opinion from "super standard checkraise and bet all the way" to "Both c/r and c/c on the flop are reasonable" [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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#80
10-09-2007, 12:27 PM
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Re: Playing against a LAG with weak two pair on a paired board
[ QUOTE ]
holy nitpicking a) he can have 87, hell I could have 87 here [/ QUOTE ] wtf? vilain just DONT have 87 and you DONT c/f the river. what is the point of posting stats if people came up with this crap? a 40/19 guy has 87 like 1 time in 100 if he raises first in UTG+1. I dont know where the river c/f comes from but I tend to either c/c or b/? the river. the river 7 makes your hand better, not worse
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