How does Phil Hellmuth win tournaments?

[beanie]

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Not buying it. Lots of people have been playing as many tournaments as him for just as long and lack the 40 top 10 finishes. It's not like he luckboxed into 11 bracelets. He makes the final table a lot and converts a lot. For all his character flaws, he is a remarkably talented tournament hold 'em player.

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Todd Brunson said if he had any idea bracelets would have been so valuable in later years he likely still wouldn't get out of the cash games he was in, but it would have at least been tempting.

[vhawk01]

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Not buying it. Lots of people have been playing as many tournaments as him for just as long and lack the 40 top 10 finishes. It's not like he luckboxed into 11 bracelets. He makes the final table a lot and converts a lot. For all his character flaws, he is a remarkably talented tournament hold 'em player.

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Do you have any reason to think that Phil Hellmuth hasn't played by far the most WSOP events in history?

[jmill2511]

Winning WSOP events does not make you a great player. It means you are capable of beating primarily weak fields consisting of alot of average to horrible players. Wow, what an accomplishment. Poker is not like other games/sports. He's not out there playing against the best or even great competitiion. He's just playing against anyone who has the money.

Just because they gave it the [censored] retarded name "World Series Of Poker" doesn't mean it's some huge accomplishment to beat a bunch of monkeys 11 times in 20 years.

[RedneckCracka]

he is raising alot preflop with crap, and after they reraise back he is givin famous speaches. And eventualy he gets great hand and some donk pays him off big way.
And with 3000 players, 2950 donkeys, he will win it once per year!

[ActionStan]

Yes, TJ Cloutier

[ActionStan]

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I mean He is just an over the top ego-maniac.
...snip...

Oh without question. A very disagreeable, annoying blowhard. And you're right, there are a whole host of very talented players out there. Several of which are just as good or better.

I misread your post a bit. Playing a lot absolutely contributed. What I don't buy is notion that he won a lot only because he played a lot. Lot's of people play a lot. Saying that it is only because he plays a lot that he has put up the results he had just doesn't ring true to me. For as irritating as he is, for as egotistical as he is, for as loathsome as he is, he still deserves credit where credit is due. He has won a lot for a long time. I just don't think it was by accident or by being an above average player in a sea of bad players.

[balk]

The Phil Hellmuth hat around here is rediculous.

There are many people who play tons of tournaments and there is nobody who comes close to his consistency of getting deep and cashing in tournaments.

Also, this idea that he can't play cash games is BS. Everybody uses HSP as their example but he had a couple brutal hands. How many people could fold top two against a bottom set. The other hand against the quad eights was rough too although he could have gotten away from that one. This season he has played fairly well. The hand with his pocket 9s showed he had good instincts pre-flop to re-raise. He called out Laak AJ hand and his hand where he asks Laak the odds of a A+flush draw against a pocket pair showed he knew what was going on.

I will not defend his antics because I find him and Matusow a pain to watch on TV and I was happy he was broken in HSP season 1 but I don't know how a bunch of internet nobodies can constantly criticize a guy how has had so much success throughout a career, especially when so few others have matched the success.

Cheers,

Balk

[Poker Clif]

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He wears jacket and sunglasses and becomes a statue to hide HIS tells.

The rest is playing TAG and picking his spots and estimating people's cards is not brain surgery, I've made some great reads, just not on TV. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Jesus is a statue as well, but he doesn't win as often as PH (though he's certainly in the conversation).

[Farfenugen]

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Winning WSOP events does not make you a great player. It means you are capable of beating primarily weak fields consisting of alot of average to horrible players. Wow, what an accomplishment. Poker is not like other games/sports. He's not out there playing against the best or even great competitiion. He's just playing against anyone who has the money.


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This is exactly what makes him a great player. Phil outplays idiots better than anyone else.

[jogsxyz]

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Yes, TJ Cloutier

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And Men 'the master'.