I am no longer tipping the dealers at CAZ until.......(long)

[CAZdealer1]

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OK why isnt howard getting banned, TT? this is rude also.

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You know something, MrFakeNameAccount, you are not doing a lot (positive) for the reputation of CAZ dealers.

[/ QUOTE ]I dont give a damn buddy

[Howard Beale]

Let me[ QUOTE ]
Howard sorry I was steaming, you should already know who this is. It's "me". Anyway, my point is, your making my wife and kids suffer so you can make a point, and I dont think its right. Howard I dont want to get in a fight with you, I apoligize for being rude. GL

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Why didn't you say so when we talked last night? Listen, you're the LAST guy I don't want to tip and I'll definitely catch up w/ you at Christmas. You know you can trust me on that. btw: I never knew you could get so worked up.


How about this?: You tell ME what to do. I've already talked w/ Rita. She says she'll bring it up at the next dealer meeting. You tell me that you'll back her up and talk the subject up with the other dealers and I'll stop w/ the no tipping thing and wait to see what happens. How does that sound?

[that_pope]

Always one to cause problems. First the cell phone thing, now this....I rarely have problems with this at 8/16, or the few times I sit in a 6/12 or 5/150 game. There are a few nutjobs who cant keep themselves from commenting on the action, but for the most part, it doesn't occur anywhere as frequently as you would like us to think.

You will have to have a ton of will power to not tip anymore, I just don't see how you will keep it up. You will probably revert back a day later just like CAZ IWTSTH ruling....

And when do I get a nice skillet?

[KurtSF]

Just wanted to add my two cents.

I've got no problem with withholding tips, but your protest won't have any effect if you do not make it known why you are doing this. You <u>must</u> communicate to anyone you can at CAZ - players, dealers, floor, etc. - that you are not tipping because the games are not being managed properly.

Too bad Mike couldn't keep his cool long enough to open a dialog here. Oh well.

[psandman]

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It seems odd to me, that he doesn't have any regular players that he would be comfortable asking about a tipping situation. But, I often forget the Midwest is quite different from other parts of the country.

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I deal in a room with many regular players. Some whom I consider nothing more than customers, some whom I consider aquaintences, few whom I consider friends, and once I even dated a player (that was a mistake).

If a friend raised a tipping issue with me privately I would respond, but i would never initiate any sort of discussion about why someone wasn't tipping me with a player whether they were a friend or not.

As far as I am concerened its not an issue a dealer should ever be raising regardless of the relationship between the dealer and player.

[Wongboy]

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Do you tip at a restaurant if you recieve okay but not outstanding service? The same should apply to the dealers.

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Here is my process for determining a waiter / waitress tip on a decent dinner ($100+ bill):
&gt; I start by assuming outstanding service and a 25% tip amount.
&gt; I deduct 5% for any significant issues that are in the control of the waiter/waitress. For example, I do not base my tip at all on the quality of the food, but the tip is definately impacted by the waiters response to any complaints, etc.
&gt; I will add an additional 5% if the service is exceptional.
&gt; In the end, I figure out the tip amount and round up to the next $5. I alsways tip an even $5 amount ($25, $30, etc).

I probably average about 22% or so (I reduction, and then rounded up). I have tipped zero on 2-3 occasions and each time I have sought out the manager and explained the reason for no tip.

So yes, I do tip a reduced amount for "okay but not outstanding" service. However, if the waiter failed to do something basic to their job then I would probably have reduced the tip to zero and complained to their boss.

[psandman]

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If the floors won't enforce the rules and the dealers feel powerless because of that then I see nothing wrong with not tipping the dealers because eventually they will start comparing notes on breaks, etc (dealers do talk to one another about players - especially at smaller, one to a city casinos), and they can decide to take this up with management. If enough dealers insist that management force the floors to follow proper poker policy then it can have an effect. I doubt this will be a quick task though.

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The problem with this approach is that it assumes that the deales will put togther what issues Howard has and then come to the joint conclusion that they need to speak to there supervisors to complain that the supervisors aren't backing them up on rules issues.

Its just to tenous and its not likely to work out that way.

My suggestion to Howard is to speak to some other ergular players who have the same issues with the way the game is run. Select players who are respected in the room (not the pain in the ass guys) and then jointly approach management with these issues. If five of you make an appointment to meet with the manager and relay your issues in a clear and direct manner you will have a much better chance of seeing your concerns addressed.

[andyfox]

To me, keeping the game fair trumps any thoughts about wising up the unwise.

[steamboatin]

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As far as I am concerened its not an issue a dealer should ever be raising regardless of the relationship between the dealer and player.

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That is a damn good answer and I respect you a lot.

[steamboatin]

I respect Howard's right to withold tips but that probably isn't how I would handle it. I would write a multipage letter to the CEO and another to the Gaming Commission or whomever is in charge.