Tone and Flaming in SSNL: PLEASE READ

[Isura]

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I think the cheese thread is a great way to keep the (LC/NC) threads to a minimum and try to emphasize strat in the strat forum. It's also a good place to 'hang out' with SSNLers, and does a good job of making this place more of a community. If that is the only thread you read, you're hurting yourself and don't really have anyone else to blame. Like smoking- don't blame big tobacco, you're the one who decides to light up.

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Here's the common situation: Good poster logs on for 1/2 hour or whatever for some 2p2 reading. First page, usually within the top 10 threads is the cheese thread. So he wonders in there because its fun, and heck, who doesn't like killing time and doing some casual reading. Maybe then he'll read a thread or two, post a one liner. But then goes back to see what else happened in the cheese thread (can you tell I'm guilty of this [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]). I think it is great that we have thread to nurture a small community of poker players, but good discussion in strategy posts can result in the same sense of community. We can still have monthly goals and results thread to brag/complain/whatever. But I think that having such a thread running for the whole month is doing more harm than good.

[Grunch]

I have 2 altrernate suggestions.

One, eliminate the cheese thread for a month. See what happens. See if the forum gets better or worse. Similar theory to when bison took down the converter for a month.

Two, limit the cheese thread to only Fridays and Saturdays (or something). See what happens.

[Paul Thomson]

Fwiw, i was posting in the thread that was in question regarding Matt and Limon.

And although I came to the defense of Limon when the flaming started, I was also quick to point out that he called True a 'tool'. My point is that just because he's served his time on these forums should make him excempt from being banned.

[Keyser.]

I love the cheese thread but getting rid of it might be for the best because maybe I'd actually start to read strat posts again.

and fwiw I really don't think the flaming is very bad here, but whatever.

[einherjar]

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I love the cheese thread but getting rid of it might be for the best because maybe I'd actually start to read strat posts again.

and fwiw I really don't think the flaming is very bad here, but whatever.

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prob because you have a spine, unlike many who get really offended at stupid internet stuff. seriously.

[Isura]

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I love the cheese thread but getting rid of it might be for the best because maybe I'd actually start to read strat posts again.

and fwiw I really don't think the flaming is very bad here, but whatever.

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prob because you have a spine, unlike many who get really offended at stupid internet stuff. seriously.

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dude, you've been here for a week. A lot of the older guys see this as just an extension of normal human contact. It doesn't give you the license to act like a complete tool (I'm not referring to you, just your comment).

[Fly]

AJ,

You are completely wrong about the tone of posts directed at limon in that thread. Honestly, the tone should have been much harsher (imo, it was muted) precisely b/c he is a (respected?) HSNL poster when you consider the sheer stupidity of his advice (minraise turn w/ the intention of folding) since readers are more likely to take him seriously. If it was some newcomer w/ 10 posts, then the response should be to gently point out why he is wrong (b/c there far less of a chance that his post would harm someone else's game and to encourage him to keep posting).

[einherjar]

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I love the cheese thread but getting rid of it might be for the best because maybe I'd actually start to read strat posts again.

and fwiw I really don't think the flaming is very bad here, but whatever.

[/ QUOTE ]

prob because you have a spine, unlike many who get really offended at stupid internet stuff. seriously.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude, you've been here for a week. A lot of the older guys see this as just an extension of normal human contact. It doesn't give you the license to act like a complete tool (I'm not referring to you, just your comment).

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dude, post count/reg dates don't matter! you think you're a better person/poster because of those things? come on. But with my comment I wasn't trying to stir up comflict NOR do i think it's ok to act like that online, I'm just saying that lots of things said in jest get misunderstood and people take criticism really tough online for a variety of different reasons. chill out.

[the machine]

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AJ,

You are completely wrong about the tone of posts directed at limon in that thread. Honestly, the tone should have been much harsher (imo, it was muted) precisely b/c he is a (respected?) HSNL poster when you consider the sheer stupidity of his advice (minraise turn w/ the intention of folding) since readers are more likely to take him seriously. If it was some newcomer w/ 10 posts, then the response should be to gently point out why he is wrong (b/c there far less of a chance that his post would harm someone else's game and to encourage him to keep posting).

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point being here fly is that there is no need to falme away. these are his ideas. there is no poker formula. a minraise may be the best option at one point for a certain reason whateevr it may be. it make work for him and may be a very important part to his game. i personally do not care for min raising and hardly ever do it unless im trying to squeeze every cent of value on a river bet. and even still if he bets 15 im making it 35... JMO

but his ideas doesnt mean he should get flamed. it means they should be discussed. everyone has a method to their madness.

for example, lets say hypothetically 100NL 6max i have 100BB from CO and hold 72o. folds to me and villain in BB is a solid player but is capable of mega tilt. he has 5000BB. i raise my CO with 72o and it folds to him he reraises. what do i do?

the whole forum says fold fold fold OBV n00b moran etc etc. and obv this is the standard play and OBV not raising is as well.

but in this situation i may shove because i know if i suck out on him he will go on mega tilt and dump his 5000BB to me, granted that i ran good and got some cards.

someone can always have a resaon for something you dont agree with. it doesnt mean that theirs is wrong and yours was right or vice versa. its no reason to flame them.

[PBJaxx]

First of all, AJ, great thread. Thanks. This has been bugging me for awhile, but I obviously don't garner the respect you do around here, so I didn't feel like I could say something. This is something we all need to work on, including myself.

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also,

I would just like to add a few things:

I think that if we all try to explain our answers more carefully, you'll see a lot less flaming and stuff. I know that I'm just as responsible as others for short answers, but if we all try for longer answers, it will help every1. These flaming wars a lot of the time start as:

Person 1: fold
Person 2: "fold" LOL, YOU'RE A MORON
Person 1: HU for rollz

etc. etc.

Now I know that AJ is also talking a lot about how limon, matt etc have been received. Personally, I think that sunny and matt have been treated fine and that its really only limon that has had abuse directed at him. There are people who have made stupid 1 line remarks, and obv those people are just stupid in doing so. HOWEVER, I also think some of the blame lies at limon's feet. He's suggesting lines that are going very strongly against the grain of SSNL's thoughts and isn't really backing them up with much....except by saying that he has a minraising "strategy" or whatever. Now I'm sure he does and it works well, but by coming in and just showing 1 hand to minraise in and not explaining why, it doesn't really help our game.

If you have a look at the matt/true discussion about low PPs, by the end, both parties were explaining their thoughts completely and we were getting a fantastic discussion....so I certainly hope we can get more of that in the future

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Dan,

Link to the True/Matt discussion? Even a key word or two that I could search? Thanks!