Coaching WARNING

[Taylor Caby]

snowbank, if you are reading this:

giving refunds is a part of business. i deal with this everyday and doing the right thing will go a lot farther than the extra few hundred dollars in your pocket.

in the future please refrain from making claims about my business when you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

thanks,

tc

[BalugaWhale]

I have coached a number of times, it is simple. Just do one session at a time. If the dude isn't satisfied he doesn't have to do another one, that's fine. The coach should be available to talk on IM at his leisure, and coaching session times should be scheduled.

If the person you're working with doesn't follow this guidelines, you shouldn't work with him.

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[TheWorstPlayer]

I responded in the General Holdem thread a few times, but I'll repeat it here for people who didn't see that thread. I coached Snowbank briefly and spoke with him several times. He seems like a good guy, he's definitely a winning player, I know nothing of his coaching quality or style. I am surprised that he would not refund the unused lessons. As other people have mentioned, it is very standard practice to refund an unused portion of a pre-paid service. And if the refund was being requested because the student found my coaching to be bad, then I personally would offer to refund the entire amount, even for the two hours of coaching I received. I value my reputation and living up to my personal standards for excellence well above any amount of money I could make from coaching.

However, I also can understand Snowbank's perspective here. If we give him the benefit of the doubt, he had several students to choose from. He chose this one student based primarily on the fact that he was willing to pay for 5 sessions upfront. Snowbank has to turn away his other students who go and get coaching elsewhere. Then this student wants to refund over half of his money. Snowbank now has no other students to coach and will be giving up the main reason for why he took this student in the first place. I could see how he would be reluctant to do that.

Not to just shill for my friends, but I think this is a decent example of why it may be worthwhile to go with coaching from a place like 3-bet, cardrunners, stoxpoker, or some other more established place. They will be more organized, will have an established reputation, will have clearer rules of business, and in the event that your coach is unavailable for a week or two they can probably get you a well-qualified substitute on a temporary basis. Not that freelance guys are bad, but coaching is a large investment, and you need to take steps to make sure you're well-informed and protected.

[Piece of Cake]

deleted - made while on lifetilt.

[pwnasor]

Guys,

Has snowbank replied at all? Maybe we should give him a chance to.

[Freelancer]

Reading all of this I am starting to second guess myself, I am fairly sure I referred the poster above towards snowbank in good faith and I'm really pissed that he had a [censored] experience. All I can say and keep saying is that I never had any problems what so ever...

[wrschultz]

[ QUOTE ]
But I want a coach that isn't taking on as many students as they can fit in but one who realizes that coaching takes more than just sweating a session in terms of prep.

Look he bought it - opened the wrapper - ate half. But just because half the candy is left, doesn't mean the remaining half is worth half of what he paid. The wrapper is used (planning) and the opportunity cost of selling the full bar to someone else has been wasted.

In fact, the meat of his knowledge may be revealed in the first two lessons and the next 3 are worth marginally less anyway.

I still maintain that an individual lesson would cost more per lesson than if you buy a package of 5. Then throw in the opportunity cost of losing out on signing another long term (5 session) student, etc.

Thinks are cheaper when bought in bulk. You can't buy a value pack and then return the unused portion for the cost of the individual sale price and it certainly does NOT apply when we're talking about intellectual capital, or service that require preparation and a committment of services that come with an opportunity cost.

[/ QUOTE ]

In regards to the planning aspect of coaching in general, I have one quote from me "session" last night.

snowbank1515 (12:51:26 AM): and other hands figure out the BEST possible move
snowbank1515 (12:51:33 AM): thinking deep about them helps your game overall
snowbank1515 (12:51:39 AM): save those hands for review after sessions
I AmBuddySchultz (12:51:41 AM): i constantly think about hands
snowbank1515 (12:51:47 AM): for next session save a ton of hands
snowbank1515 (12:51:50 AM): and we'll go over them
snowbank1515 (12:51:54 AM): i think thatd help a lot
snowbank1515 (12:52:02 AM): overall u seem to be playing pretty well
I AmBuddySchultz (12:52:03 AM): i have saved a few
snowbank1515 (12:52:09 AM): most decisions seem solid
snowbank1515 (12:52:22 AM): but sometimes u need to think a little beyond the thinking
snowbank1515 (12:52:26 AM): to outplay opponents
snowbank1515 (12:52:30 AM): but we'll work on that
snowbank1515 (12:52:42 AM): so for next session save me a bunch of hands and we'll focus on that


What I get out of this is... You are playing pretty well but we need to take it to the next level! Don't worry it's easy. What you need to do is save a lot of hands so I don't really have to prepare anything, and then I'll just sit down in AIM and pretend I'm focusing on what you're talking about and you'll pay me $150 for it! Whee.

[MilkMan]

and that folks is how you make 10ptbb/100

[Ralph Wiggum]

[ QUOTE ]
and that folks is how you make 10ptbb/100

[/ QUOTE ]
LOL, Snowbank pwns n00bs.

[Requin]

He gets 200$/hour for that? I need to start coaching.