MSNBC Front page...

[PrayingMantis]

[ QUOTE ]
Nobody reads the front page.

[/ QUOTE ]

You mean: almost everybody read nothing but the front page?

[aislephive]

[ QUOTE ]
this is the end of online poker the way we know it. Im glad it became public though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Everybody needs to relax. I really doubt this will make any noticeable impact on the online poker scene. First of all, anybody who plays poker online is going to take time and actually read the article, and it should be pretty obvious after reading the article that it is an isolated incident and far from the norm in online poker. The people who are just looking at the headlines are people who don't give a damn about online poker to begin with and probably had no intention of ever playing in the first place, especially after UIGEA.

Lastly, some good can come out of this. Think about it. The government really can't do much more to hurt online poker than what has already been done, and there is a chance that they see this incident as proof that foreign based online poker rooms aren't safe for Americans, and since they know they can't do anything to stop people from playing online, they decide to tax and regulate it so they can be sure the online poker scene is safe in their hands.

Now that's optimistic thinking no doubt, but it's well within the realms of possibility. And I think that is a far likelier result than this story doing any kind of major damage to online poker as we know it today.

[PrayingMantis]

OK, something about cold meds at the top. Instead of this horrifying pic of exposed cards all around the table.

[PrayingMantis]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
this is the end of online poker the way we know it. Im glad it became public though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Everybody needs to relax. I really doubt this will make any noticeable impact on the online poker scene. First of all, anybody who plays poker online is going to take time and actually read the article, and it should be pretty obvious after reading the article that it is an isolated incident and far from the norm in online poker. The people who are just looking at the headlines are people who don't give a damn about online poker to begin with and probably had no intention of ever playing in the first place, especially after UIGEA.

Lastly, some good can come out of this. Think about it. The government really can't do much more to hurt online poker than what has already been done, and there is a chance that they see this incident as proof that foreign based online poker rooms aren't safe for Americans, and since they know they can't do anything to stop people from playing online, they decide to tax and regulate it so they can be sure the online poker scene is safe in their hands.

Now that's optimistic thinking no doubt, but it's well within the realms of possibility. And I think that is a far likelier result than this story doing any kind of major damage to online poker as we know it today.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good points, but you do realize that this story, with those horrible headlines, might make it almost impossible to convince new players to somehow start and play poker online? And possibly not only in America, which is a complete disaster? I'm pretty sure it's going to be all around the world media, in this form or other. It's a nice fun story, even if you don't give a [censored] about online poker, or any gambling or anything like that, and you're just a bored editor looking for cool news stories. And it's a very nice, sexy, story.

It's really really bad, IMO.

[Mike Kelley]

Has about the standard amount of disinformation the drive-by media normally provides.

[questions]

[ QUOTE ]
Every minute that passes and the msnbc homepage still looks like that, regardless of the content of the article, represents an exponentially growing disaster for online poker in its current state.

2+2 guys (ad and all) have made an amazing job on this, but the end result could be very sad for us all. And I'm not usually that pessimistic...

I really hope I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

I take a different view. If people were being robbed, then the sooner this scam was exposed, the better. I don't see much of a downside to exposing this. Further, it serves as a caution to other sites that integrity and fairness are essential. Isn't that what all of us want, in the end? Or do we play poker so that we can literally be robbed?

[aislephive]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
this is the end of online poker the way we know it. Im glad it became public though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Everybody needs to relax. I really doubt this will make any noticeable impact on the online poker scene. First of all, anybody who plays poker online is going to take time and actually read the article, and it should be pretty obvious after reading the article that it is an isolated incident and far from the norm in online poker. The people who are just looking at the headlines are people who don't give a damn about online poker to begin with and probably had no intention of ever playing in the first place, especially after UIGEA.

Lastly, some good can come out of this. Think about it. The government really can't do much more to hurt online poker than what has already been done, and there is a chance that they see this incident as proof that foreign based online poker rooms aren't safe for Americans, and since they know they can't do anything to stop people from playing online, they decide to tax and regulate it so they can be sure the online poker scene is safe in their hands.

Now that's optimistic thinking no doubt, but it's well within the realms of possibility. And I think that is a far likelier result than this story doing any kind of major damage to online poker as we know it today.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good points, but you do realize that this story, with those horrible headlines, might make it almost impossible to convince new players to somehow start and play poker online? And possibly not only in America, which is a complete disaster? I'm pretty sure it's going to be all around the world media, in this form or other. It's a nice fun story, even if you don't give a [censored] about online poker, or any gambling or anything like that, and you're just a bored editor looking for cool news stories. And it's a very nice, sexy, story.

It's really really bad, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

I still contend that anybody who shares any interest in online poker will take the time to read the article. I agree as a whole this is not a good thing for online poker whatsoever, but even so I don't think we will see any noticeable impact in the games. It will be a very subtle thing, except for the impact on AP, which will obviously be tremendous (although if they aren't stripped of their license I think will be fine, but will have taken a huge hit, at least temporarily). I severely doubt we will see a drop in players on sites like FTP or PS. That's just my opinion of course, we'll find out for sure as this thing develops over the coming weeks/months.

[KurtSF]

[ QUOTE ]
So is the idea that this is actually a rogue employee proving a point a new one? I hadn't seen it in any of the summary threads that I've followed.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's because it wasn't in any of the threads. Its first appearance was when the AP rep told the reporter, and it doesn't account for most of the points we know to be fact.

363
owners of cheating accounts
scott tom's home cable modem
scope of cheating
chip dumping
(I could go on)

In fact, they are already backpedaling on the story.

From MSN article, quoting an AP rep:

[ QUOTE ]
“This is literally a geek trying to prove to senior management that they were wrong and he took it too far,” he said.

[/ QUOTE ]

From N 82 50 24 discussing his conversation with an AP rep:

[ QUOTE ]
Among other things, he said that "geek" was not a correct term to be used here and if someone said that it was not what AP meant.

[/ QUOTE ]

We still haven't seen:

* official statement from AP
* proof of any of the claims AP makes in the article
* results of an open and independent audit

[PrayingMantis]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Every minute that passes and the msnbc homepage still looks like that, regardless of the content of the article, represents an exponentially growing disaster for online poker in its current state.

2+2 guys (ad and all) have made an amazing job on this, but the end result could be very sad for us all. And I'm not usually that pessimistic...

I really hope I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

I take a different view. If people were being robbed, then the sooner this scam was exposed, the better. I don't see much of a downside to exposing this. Further, it serves as a caution to other sites that integrity and fairness are essential. Isn't that what all of us want, in the end? Or do we play poker so that we can literally be robbed?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course, as I said, this was an amazing job by 2+2 guys, adanthar, nat, and others. However, the media, as a whole, really cares very little about the specific of the story. For them it's bascially a juicy, sexy story. Yes, the media really helps in such a fight (pressure, exposure, etc), but it's a two-sided sword. I'm positive that all other poker sites are now in a state of complete freak-out, and there's not really a lot they can do, media-wise. Because the media will only be interested in this story up to a certain point. Full tilt saying: "we're legit! no rigging here! we have top security!" is really very very weak and uninteresting follow-up for this story (media-wise), as sad as it is.

[HSB]

[ QUOTE ]
Every minute that passes and the msnbc homepage still looks like that, regardless of the content of the article, represents an exponentially growing disaster for online poker in its current state.

2+2 guys (ad and all) have made an amazing job on this, but the end result could be very sad for us all. And I'm not usually that pessimistic...

I really hope I'm wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're wrong.